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I Have a Dream … Of a Really Boring Uniform

martin_luther_king_jr.jpg

Unless you were paying very close attention to the fine print, you may have missed a small news item that came out of the baseball GMs’ winter meetings last December: The Cardinals and Indians will play an exhibition game on March 31st in Memphis, billed as the first annual Civil Rights Game. Memphis was chosen as the site because it’s the site of Martin Luther King Jr.’s assassination and the home of the National Civil Rights Museum, and proceeds will go to various baseball- and African American-related charities. Additional details are available here and here.

Unsurprisingly, the Tribe and Cards will be wearing a sleeve patch for the occasion. What I didn’t know until a few days ago, when reader Ben Penserga brought it to my attention, is that both teams will also be wearing special uniforms — assuming you can call this and this special, that is.

Not exactly an inspiring design, right? I was curious about the thinking behind the it, so I called the MLB offices, where a very inexperienced-sounding spokesperson told me, “They just wanted to look different for that game, I guess.” Then she said, “Wait, I guess I should really check on that. I’ll get back to you.” She called back about two hours later and, clearly reading from a written statement prepared by someone else, told me, “The designs were inspired by the simplicity of Negro Leagues uniforms. Because at the end of the day, it’s the game that’s important, not the uniforms.”

Let’s try to ignore the immense intellectual poverty of that last sentence and instead focus on the supposed Negro Leagues connection. True, some Negro League unis were extremely simple, but most were at least somewhat flashier. Even the old St. Louis Stars uniforms, which were very plain, at least had a colored placket and radially arched lettering, which is more than what you can say for what the Cardinals will be wearing. And besides, by now MLB has done loads of Negro Leagues throwback games, and the uniforms always look better than these Civil Rights Game duds.

Other questions: Why put city names on both jerseys, instead of letting at least one club wear its team name? And why use what appears to be exact same typeface for both jerseys, making the uniforms seem like generic knockoffs? Given that one of the game’s stated purposes is “to attract more young blacks to the sport” (an issue gaining lots of media attention these days), wouldn’t it make sense to come up with a more appealing uniform design?

If they really want to push the civil rights envelope, let’s see them have the guts to field a team wearing this design — now that would make a statement. (For those who are new to the blog, the full story behind that photo is here.)

System of Dreck: More info continues to appear about Nike’s new college hoops uniforms. I don’t really feel like dignifying the debate, because the whole thing is so insipid. But in the interests of being informative, I’ll pass along the latest info, which you can find here, here, and here.

Uni Watch News Ticker: Excellent hosiery stylings at Texas A&M (courtesy of Glenn Stern). … ” The Maple Leafs had a special outdoor practice on Monday,” writes AJ Brandt, “and it looks like they were wearing Home Depot advertising patches on their practice jerseys.” … Reprinted from yesterday’s comments: Good article here on the woman who’s the seamstress for the UHL’s Ft. Wayne Komets. … Juan Pierre’s cap-under-the-helmet thing looks pretty weird when the cap in question is a BP cap. … “I’ve been covering the Iowa Girls State Basketball Tournament this week and two uni-related items have jumped out at me,” writes Jesse Gavin. “First, check out the wild shoelaces on Bedford’s Elaine Mauderly. Oddly enough, the orange shoelaces with black shoes matched the color scheme of her team’s opponent, Graettinger-Terril. Second, you have to love the socks that every girl on the Decorah team is wearing — long socks with blue and red stripes and their Viking logo to boot.”

 

214 comments to I Have a Dream … Of a Really Boring Uniform

  • NickNH | March 7, 2007 at 8:46 am |

    I’ll take Pierre’s side on this one…it’s possibly the one area of unis where I never, ever cared about how it looked. The feel of the helmet on my head never seemed right. I always wore a hat under there, and not necessarily my team hat. If we had foam domes as team hats, I’d usually wear some form of hat that fit the head better under the helmet, since it wasn’t like I had to worry about the logo of my non-team hat appearing on the field.

    Other than that, I had to look right. Black spikes, high stirrups (we had solid navy blue), high pants (I actually took pants for two straight years that were ripped in the elastic because it was easier to rig them up high.)

  • Original Jim | March 7, 2007 at 8:53 am |

    If MLB wanted to keep the simplistic look, at least they could have used an Athletic-looking font.

    But Impact? IMPACT?

    If you can set it in Word, it doesn’t belong on a uniform.

  • Zachattac | March 7, 2007 at 8:56 am |

    [quote comment=”58836″]If MLB wanted to keep the simplistic look, at least they could have used an Athletic-looking font.

    But Impact? IMPACT?

    If you can set it in Word, it doesn’t belong on a uniform.[/quote]

    Either that or they could have given the script some sort of shadow or outline or second color. Something at least. Good ‘ol MlB.
    Z

  • Clevo | March 7, 2007 at 9:00 am |

    if they wanted to honor the negro Leagues, why not have them in St Louis Stars and Cleveland Buckeye unis?

    http://www.cleveland...

  • Ben | March 7, 2007 at 9:06 am |

    The Leafs had a Home Depot patch on their jerseys for the outdoor practice because the Leafs and Home Depot had a joint venture to revitalize the old outdoor rink in Etobicoke, just outside of Toronto (where the practice was held). If you can find an image of the rink itself, you’ll see the boards are decorated with Leafs and Home Dep. advertising.
    So while you child is taking his first strides on his skates, he’ll know where to go for his home renovation needs, and who to cheer for if he likes having his heart broken by mediocrity.

  • Matt | March 7, 2007 at 9:07 am |

    anyone else think its ironic that the Indians are playing in a civil rights game?

  • Kim | March 7, 2007 at 9:10 am |

    Kind of interesting that the “Civil Rights Game” features a team that several Native American groups have targeted because of the ‘demeaning’ name.

    The Unis look more like some mid-90’s non-licensed Nintendo product than an actual MLB product. Though it does make the BP and All-Star stuff look better.

  • Greg | March 7, 2007 at 9:11 am |

    Why does the player from A&M have a QB wristband? Does he need to be reminded “on the ground run, in the air go halfway”?

  • Ben N | March 7, 2007 at 9:13 am |

    It looks like the Girl in the black uniform from the Iowa HS Basketball tourney is wearing a spandex uniform! Maybe Nike has hit high school already!

  • Ben N | March 7, 2007 at 9:13 am |

    It looks like the Girl in the black uniform from the Iowa HS Basketball tourney is wearing a spandex uniform! Maybe Nike has hit high school already!

  • Brady | March 7, 2007 at 9:18 am |

    What about Oakland University’s unis in the Mid-Con final last night with their names BELOW the number and that thing (a Grizzly) on the back of their shorts?
    I thought they looked hideous and it looked like they sat in something.

  • Brady | March 7, 2007 at 9:19 am |

    Here’s a photo link:
    http://sports.espn.g...

  • Dwight | March 7, 2007 at 9:22 am |

    Anyone else having seizures after seeing all the “extra-curriculars” on the A&M baseball unis? American Flag, HUGE Big 12 patch, Huge Texas patch, and of course, she swoosh.

  • ryan | March 7, 2007 at 9:23 am |

    Its a new era of logo creep. I was watching College Gamenight (sponsored by KFC) when I noticed that the Colonel’s apron is sponsored by Adidas. Check it out, there is NO other reason to have 3 stripes on there like they are. OK, maybe I’m joking, but it is a litle creepy.

  • todd krevanchi | March 7, 2007 at 9:28 am |

    the arizona and ohio st shorts design is nice, although a bit too long for my taste (and im a big proponent of baggy shorts)

    i guess it would have been too much to simply keep the current templates, and change the fabrics.

    if i remember correctly, at the beginning of the year when thad matta was asked about bringing back the grays (which i love!), he was unsure due to the “high cost” of having to manufacture an entire 3rd set of unis and whether or not it was in his budget…

  • Ben Wideman | March 7, 2007 at 9:29 am |

    [quote comment=”58840″]anyone else think its ironic that the Indians are playing in a civil rights game?[/quote]

    VERY well said. My guess is that is the biggest reason that both teams have their city instead of their team name on their chest.

  • John in Athens | March 7, 2007 at 9:34 am |

    Things wrong with the “Civil Rights” game:

    1. The Indians and playing in it
    2. It is taking place where MLK was killed
    3. Simplyifing modern unis to mimic the Negro Leagues is insulting
    4. Negro League uni were no more simple than MLB unis of the era
    5. The Negro Leagues had as much to do with Civil Rights as the assination of MLK

    If MLB wants to celebrate Civil Rights, how about putting a spotlight on teams, players, and moments who helped usher our country out of the dark ages (we’re still not there, by the way)? How about wearing uniforms of black MLB pioneers?

    This reeks of MLB’s white guilt.

    The heart is there, but the delivery isn’t.

  • Jason | March 7, 2007 at 9:36 am |

    Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.

  • kc | March 7, 2007 at 9:37 am |

    [quote comment=”58842″]Why does the player from A&M have a QB wristband? Does he need to be reminded “on the ground run, in the air go halfway”?[/quote]

    It’s probably a mini-scouting report. Usually the coaching staff will put the opposing players tendencies to where they hit the ball or the like on it. If the player is a catcher, than it’s probably the report on how the pitching staff should pitch to certain people.

  • Jeff E. | March 7, 2007 at 9:38 am |

    The Maple Leafs players remind me of Robocop

  • Greg | March 7, 2007 at 9:38 am |

    Someone mentioned in the comments on Sunday that the nameplate on Tom Brady’s jersey might be switched to T. BRADY now that the Pats have signed TE Kyle Brady, but according to this article that isn’t going to happen. (Down at the bottom of the page.)

  • Paul Lukas | March 7, 2007 at 9:41 am |

    [quote comment=”58855″]Someone mentioned in the comments on Sunday that the nameplate on Tom Brady’s jersey might be switched to T. BRADY now that the Pats have signed TE Kyle Brady, but according to this article that isn’t going to happen. (Down at the bottom of the page.)[/quote]

    Great catch!

  • Jeff E. | March 7, 2007 at 9:45 am |

    [quote comment=”58851″]Things wrong with the “Civil Rights” game:

    1. The Indians and playing in it
    2. It is taking place where MLK was killed
    3. Simplyifing modern unis to mimic the Negro Leagues is insulting
    4. Negro League uni were no more simple than MLB unis of the era
    5. The Negro Leagues had as much to do with Civil Rights as the assination of MLK

    If MLB wants to celebrate Civil Rights, how about putting a spotlight on teams, players, and moments who helped usher our country out of the dark ages (we’re still not there, by the way)? How about wearing uniforms of black MLB pioneers?

    This reeks of MLB’s white guilt.

    The heart is there, but the delivery isn’t.[/quote]

    Just my feeling, but I think Memphis was chosen more because that’s the location of the Civil Rights museum than because MLK was assassinated there.

  • SaveFarris | March 7, 2007 at 9:47 am |

    “The designs were inspired by the simplicity of Negro Leagues uniforms. Because at the end of the day, it’s the game that’s important”

    … not to mention that Majestic Logo.

  • J.B. | March 7, 2007 at 9:48 am |

    let your voices be heard…

    http://www.buckeyext...

  • Jeff | March 7, 2007 at 9:51 am |

    I found this rather ironic. A quote from the si article on the uniforms linked above: “Nike said players had told the company they were looking for ways to personalize their look…”

    It is still called a UNIFORM isn’t it?

  • John in Athens | March 7, 2007 at 9:54 am |

    On second thought, I take back my “the heart’s there comment.

    The “Civil Rights” game is being played for two reasons:
    1. to test the Memphis market
    2. to grab for black wallets

    Call me cynical, but it seems that everytime MLB reaches out for a cause (Breast Cancer, Civil Rights) there is a core demographic that it’s reaching out to (Women, Blacks).

    If MLB could work out a “cause” as the reason why it has staged games in Japan, Mexico, and Puerto Rico, it would.

  • Jeff E. | March 7, 2007 at 9:58 am |

    [quote comment=”58859″]let your voices be heard…

    http://www.buckeyext...

    Other than the way it fits, I like it, especially the “O” on the skorts

  • Jim | March 7, 2007 at 10:00 am |

    Will the Indians be wearing their Chief Wahoo hats?

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 10:04 am |

    [quote comment=”58847″]Anyone else having seizures after seeing all the “extra-curriculars” on the A&M baseball unis? American Flag, HUGE Big 12 patch, Huge Texas patch, and of course, she swoosh.[/quote]
    I knew I wouldn’t be the only one that noticed all the flair on the A&M uni. I really don’t mind it, though.

    I remember in little league, we used to judge the quality of a baseball glove by all the additional markings on it. Rawlings gloves were the best, with things like ‘Radial-Arch’, ‘Fast-Back’ ‘Deep-Pocket’, and my fave ‘Edge-U-Cated Heel’.

    Sometimes clutter is good.

  • Eric | March 7, 2007 at 10:15 am |

    I gotta say that I like the Nike Syracuse home jersey. “ORANGE” is sweet!

  • Tom Flanagan | March 7, 2007 at 10:15 am |

    The System of Dress is atrocious. I actually can’t believe it.

  • Teebz | March 7, 2007 at 10:15 am |

    [quote comment=”58839″]The Leafs had a Home Depot patch on their jerseys for the outdoor practice because the Leafs and Home Depot had a joint venture to revitalize the old outdoor rink in Etobicoke, just outside of Toronto (where the practice was held). If you can find an image of the rink itself, you’ll see the boards are decorated with Leafs and Home Dep. advertising.
    So while you child is taking his first strides on his skates, he’ll know where to go for his home renovation needs, and who to cheer for if he likes having his heart broken by mediocrity.[/quote]

    Home Depot is also the NHL’s partner in the Backyard Rink contest. The winner of the best “backyard rink” gets a whole lotta shwag from the NHL.

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 10:30 am |

    [quote comment=”58867″]Home Depot is also the NHL’s partner in the Backyard Rink contest. The winner of the best “backyard rink” gets a whole lotta shwag from the NHL.[/quote]

    I ought to try this. After all, I get half a backyard in my new condo. . .

  • Kim | March 7, 2007 at 10:34 am |

    [quote comment=”58861″]

    If MLB could work out a “cause” as the reason why it has staged games in Japan, Mexico, and Puerto Rico, it would.[/quote]

    Oooh. I can’t wait for the Mariners/Dodgers “Internment Camp” game.

    Or the Diamondbacks/A’s in the “Migrant Worker” Game.

    Or the Nationals/Yankees in the “You’re just a Territory” Game.

  • Dwight | March 7, 2007 at 10:46 am |

    2 reasons for the “Civil Rights” game to be in Memphis

    1. The hotel room where MLK was assasinated is now a shrine/memorial/museum where I am sure many pay their respects – so fitting that that city where the Rights movement’s biggest voice is memorialized
    2. The Cardinals AAA club is in Memphis

    http://web.minorleag...

    BTW, how great is the Redbirds logo?

  • Teebz | March 7, 2007 at 11:14 am |

    More info on the NHL’s and Home Depot’s agreement can be found here, courtesy of Home Depot.

  • David | March 7, 2007 at 11:18 am |

    There’s no question in my mind that they had to change the uniforms for this game to remove the name “Indians” and the Wahoo logo. If that was any other ethnic group, they would have been replaced long ago. It is high irony indeed that they would choose the Indians for that game.

  • Beats | March 7, 2007 at 11:19 am |

    The Home Depot contest which may be exclusive to CBC broadcast (it’s the only station I’ve seen it on, one of the benefits of living close to the border is catching the westcoast Hockey Night in Canada Game after a Sabres game)does offer an incredible amount of prizes to the winner including Stanley Cup Final tickets, this years winner’s rink included full boards, an Oilers logo at center ice and a tractor converted into a zamboni and spans two backyards after a fence between the two was removed

  • Beantown | March 7, 2007 at 11:19 am |

    [quote comment=”58839″]The Leafs had a Home Depot patch on their jerseys for the outdoor practice because the Leafs and Home Depot had a joint venture to revitalize the old outdoor rink in Etobicoke, just outside of Toronto (where the practice was held). If you can find an image of the rink itself, you’ll see the boards are decorated with Leafs and Home Dep. advertising.
    So while you child is taking his first strides on his skates, he’ll know where to go for his home renovation needs, and who to cheer for if he likes having his heart broken by mediocrity.[/quote]

    I realize people have responded to this already, but this made me laugh out loud. As a Bruins fan, maybe they can get a sponsorship with Bed Bath and Beyond. That’s what I associate them with the most.

  • Mark in Shiga | March 7, 2007 at 11:27 am |

    Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

  • ToasterPoodle | March 7, 2007 at 11:31 am |

    [quote comment=”58852″]Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.[/quote]
    Everyone is bent out of shape about the undershirts, but remember that was just a press release photo, not an actual shot of in game use. Florida has already worn the blue version of these (on 2/27 vs. Tenn) with no odd sleeves and little fanfare. In OSU’s case, though the pants are a bit much in the length department, they are an improvement over the piped and striped train-wreck they are currently wearing.

  • Alex | March 7, 2007 at 11:36 am |

    [quote comment=”58876″]Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.[/quote]

    VERY well put!

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 11:39 am |

    I know there is not a lot about Division III hoops on here, but I just have to vent for a while. (I promise I will add some uni-related info later)

    How is it that a team ranked #5 in the nation in D3 hoops doesn’t make it into their version of the Big Dance? I am talking about University of Wisconsin Oshkosh. When the selection process happened, the Titans were ranked 5th overall in the nation, and because they did not win the Conference Tournament, they did not get the automatic bid into the tourney. Nor did they get an “At Large bid” which is given to a few teams that have produced a strong season, but didn’t win the conference tourney. Instead of the board just saying, “Sorry you don’t get a #1 seed.” They say, “Sorry, your season is over”. In the whole scheme of things, this is the equivalent of Butler not making it to the Big Dance. They are ranked #17 in the nation, but didn’t win their conference tourney, so according to D3 rules, they would not be invited to the Big Dance. I guess you can also say this is like a team like Memphis or Texas A&M not making it either. (Then again we don’t know if they will win their conference tourney yet, but you get the idea)Having a team ranked at the end of the season and not making it in the Big Dance (In any division) it a travesty.

    And to prove how un-biased I am. I am from Stevens Point, which of course is home to University of Wisconsin Stevens Point Pointers, the current #1 team in D3 basketball (WInners of the 2004, and 2005 National Championship) and conference rival of Oshkosh. The Point I am trying to make, I guess, is that if this was D1, it would be a huge deal, but because it is D3, no one really cares.

    Now on to that uni stuff I promised. The Pointers of UWSP have for years copied the Lakers in the script on their jerseys. It has bugged me since I was young. Not that I don’t like it. But I wish they had something original.

    Laker copy cats

  • jkads | March 7, 2007 at 11:41 am |

    [quote comment=”58878″][quote comment=”58852″]Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.[/quote]
    Everyone is bent out of shape about the undershirts, but remember that was just a press release photo, not an actual shot of in game use. Florida has already worn the blue version of these (on 2/27 vs. Tenn) with no odd sleeves and little fanfare. In OSU’s case, though the pants are a bit much in the length department, they are an improvement over the piped and striped train-wreck they are currently wearing.[/quote]

    From the Nike System of Dress website (Designer Q & A section):

    Florida debuted the uniforms on February 27 and they did not look as drastic as I’ve seen in some pictures from Nike. Why not?

    The Nike Pro Compression base layer that was developed for each university was not ready when Florida decided to debut its new uniform over a week early against Tennessee.

  • tedkerwin | March 7, 2007 at 11:44 am |

    Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

    I do not have the link here but I think this is not true. It was discussed in previous posts.

  • specs | March 7, 2007 at 11:49 am |

    [quote comment=”58882″]Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

    I do not have the link here but I think this is not true. It was discussed in previous posts.[/quote]

    Not to mention that the term “Indian” is completely incorrect. Was Louis Sockalexis from India? And are you advocating that baseball history is more important than taking into account whether something is offensive to Native Americans? Or any other group of people for that matter?

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 11:54 am |

    I don’t understand how Indian mascots (in college or the pros) can be viewed as negative. This topic has pissed me off for a long time. Would it be better if we changed North Dakota to the Fighting Native Americans? And why do teams with the name Warriors have to be changed? i.e. Marquette. Granted the mascot “Willie Whomp-em” was bad, their have been other warriors in history (Trojan, Spartan, Viking). I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended.

    What I am getting act, is that a lot of people can find something derogatory about a lot of mascots. But that is what they are…mascots. Not being portrayed in a negative way, but as a historical reference to that area. Pretty soon The University of California Santa Barbara is going to have to change their nickname because the Fighting Banana Slugs can be portrayed as making fun of the area of California for being slow. Oh, wait… it was changed already. They are now the Gauchos. Oh yeah… a lot better. Yeesh. What’s next?

    I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.

  • jkads | March 7, 2007 at 11:55 am |

    [quote comment=”58883″][quote comment=”58882″]Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

    I do not have the link here but I think this is not true. It was discussed in previous posts.[/quote]

    Not to mention that the term “Indian” is completely incorrect. Was Louis Sockalexis from India? And are you advocating that baseball history is more important than taking into account whether something is offensive to Native Americans? Or any other group of people for that matter?[/quote]

    From Wikipedia:

    The Indians Nickname

    Legend has it that the team honored Louis Sockalexis when it assumed its current name in 1915. The spectacular Sockalexis, a Native American, had played in Cleveland 1897-1899.

    On the contrary, when the “Naps” sent longtime leader Napoleon Lajoie to the Philadelphia Athletics at the end of the 1914 season, owner Charles Somers asked the local newspapers to come up with a new name for the team. They chose “Indians” as a play on the name of the Boston Braves, then known as the “Miracle Braves” after going from last place on July 4 to a sweep in the 1914 World Series. Proponents of the name acknowledged that the Cleveland Spiders of the National League had sometimes been informally called the “Indians” during Sockalexis’ short career there, a fact which merely reinforced the new name.

    In any case, the name stuck. And 34 years later, the Indians went on to defeat that same Braves franchise, 4 games to 2, in the 1948 World Series — after first winning a one game playoff against Boston’s other team, the Red Sox. The victory over the Braves was the franchise’s second of two World Series titles; the Tribe had also won the 1920 World Series, defeating the Brooklyn Robins 5 games to 2.

    The club nickname and its cartoon logo have been criticized for perpetuating Native American stereotypes, and protests have arisen from time to time. In 1997, during the team’s most recent World Series, three American Indian protesters were arrested, but later acquitted.

  • todd krevanchi | March 7, 2007 at 12:01 pm |

    is it just me or is it a bit contradictory to relate the negro leagues (or any other segregated league) with civil rights in this circumstance?

    i mean, wasnt the whole basis of the civil rights movement (in a sports sense anyway) to show just how ridiculous separate leagues were?

    hey, still celebrate the history and great players of the negro leagues by having the negro league throwback days… i think its necessary.

    but for mlb to issue a statement saying that the unis for a “civil rights” game are based on that of a league which segregated individuals, and offered no civil rights absolutely baffles my mind!!! was this statement thought out? are they really that insensitive?

    am i right or wrong here?

  • ToasterPoodle | March 7, 2007 at 12:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”58881″][quote comment=”58878″][quote comment=”58852″]Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.[/quote]
    Everyone is bent out of shape about the undershirts, but remember that was just a press release photo, not an actual shot of in game use. Florida has already worn the blue version of these (on 2/27 vs. Tenn) with no odd sleeves and little fanfare. In OSU’s case, though the pants are a bit much in the length department, they are an improvement over the piped and striped train-wreck they are currently wearing.[/quote]

    From the Nike System of Dress website (Designer Q & A section):

    Florida debuted the uniforms on February 27 and they did not look as drastic as I’ve seen in some pictures from Nike. Why not?

    The Nike Pro Compression base layer that was developed for each university was not ready when Florida decided to debut its new uniform over a week early against Tennessee.[/quote]
    GREAT insight. Of course I am a little worried about what we’ll see now with the undershirts. If nothing stupid happens there, the new OSU’s unis are still an upgrade.

  • Jonathon | March 7, 2007 at 12:02 pm |

    [quote comment=”58884″]I don’t understand how Indian mascots (in college or the pros) can be viewed as negative. This topic has pissed me off for a long time. Would it be better if we changed North Dakota to the Fighting Native Americans? And why do teams with the name Warriors have to be changed? i.e. Marquette. Granted the mascot “Willie Whomp-em” was bad, their have been other warriors in history (Trojan, Spartan, Viking). I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended.

    What I am getting act, is that a lot of people can find something derogatory about a lot of mascots. But that is what they are…mascots. Not being portrayed in a negative way, but as a historical reference to that area. Pretty soon The University of California Santa Barbara is going to have to change their nickname because the Fighting Banana Slugs can be portrayed as making fun of the area of California for being slow. Oh, wait… it was changed already. They are now the Gauchos. Oh yeah… a lot better. Yeesh. What’s next?

    I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.[/quote]

    That’s incorrect. UC-Santa Cruz is the Gauchos. UC-Santa Barbara is the Banana Slugs.

  • chris | March 7, 2007 at 12:02 pm |

    Yesterday’s IHSA theme got me thinking back to the greatest time in the original march madness. Only two teams left (that I know of) have sleeves on their jerseys. My alma Matter Batavia (NBA HOFamer Dan Issel,Super bowl QB Ken Anderson, Lamar Justice, Corey Williams and TNT Analyst Craig Seger) and the alma matter of Michael Finley, Doc Rivers, Dee and Shannon Brown and Brian Carwell Proviso East. They both are beautiful. To this day.

  • Jonathon | March 7, 2007 at 12:05 pm |

    Check that: Santa Cruz = Banana Slugs; Santa Barbara = Gauchos

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 12:06 pm |

    So upon further research I got the two California schools mixed up. UC-Santa Cruz picked up the Banana Slugs mascot in 1986. Since 1998, UCSB athletics have received support from a booster club, the Gaucho Locos, founded by the UCSB student body. The Gaucho Locos were originally known as the Gauchoholics but changed its name due to negative connotations.

    Sorry for the mix up…But my point was that a lot of weird things can be found as negative. Don’t be surprised if someone finds the lovable Banana Slug of UCSC negative.

  • Wade | March 7, 2007 at 12:06 pm |

    [quote comment=”58883″][quote comment=”58882″]Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

    I do not have the link here but I think this is not true. It was discussed in previous posts.[/quote]

    Not to mention that the term “Indian” is completely incorrect. Was Louis Sockalexis from India? And are you advocating that baseball history is more important than taking into account whether something is offensive to Native Americans? Or any other group of people for that matter?[/quote]

    Actually, the term “Native American” is no longer used by most entities. “American Indian” or “Alaskan Native” is now the preferred term. And here’s an additional thought, if you were born in the United States, aren’t you a “Native American”?

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 12:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”58890″]Check that: Santa Cruz = Banana Slugs; Santa Barbara = Gauchos[/quote]
    And UC Irvine = Anteaters

  • Jonathon | March 7, 2007 at 12:09 pm |

    Interesting fact – the Civil Rights Game will be the first time the Cardinals have worn a uniform with “St. Louis” on it since 1932.

    http://www.baseballh...

    Starting in ’33, and continuing until the present day, the home and road uniforms have featured “Cardinals.”

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 12:10 pm |

    Thanks Jonathon. I knew something was wrong as soon as I pressed “say it”, so I did the research on my own. My bad.

  • Kim | March 7, 2007 at 12:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”58884″]I don’t understand how Indian mascots (in college or the pros) can be viewed as negative. This topic has pissed me off for a long time. Would it be better if we changed North Dakota to the Fighting Native Americans? And why do teams with the name Warriors have to be changed? i.e. Marquette. Granted the mascot “Willie Whomp-em” was bad, their have been other warriors in history (Trojan, Spartan, Viking). I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended.

    What I am getting act, is that a lot of people can find something derogatory about a lot of mascots. But that is what they are…mascots. Not being portrayed in a negative way, but as a historical reference to that area. Pretty soon The University of California Santa Barbara is going to have to change their nickname because the Fighting Banana Slugs can be portrayed as making fun of the area of California for being slow. Oh, wait… it was changed already. They are now the Gauchos. Oh yeah… a lot better. Yeesh. What’s next?

    I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.[/quote]

    I was afraid that the discussion would turn to this.

    Personally, I don’t see how some of the names, like Fighting Sioux, are bad. Since they call out and generally honor the group.

    However, I do see names like Redskins as derogatory. Since redskins is a slur.

    But to steer the discussion back towards the Indians and the Civil Rights game. You’d think that the Civil Rights folks would be sensitive to such an issue (regardless of how some feel, it’s an issue), and they may have wanted to avoid something that one ethnic group perceives as derogatory.

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 12:15 pm |

    Actually, the term “Native American” is no longer used by most entities. “American Indian” or “Alaskan Native” is now the preferred term. And here’s an additional thought, if you were born in the United States, aren’t you a “Native American”?[/quote]

    You are right Wade. The “Native Americans” Or “Indians”, are not true American Natives. They came over from Russia across the land bridge that used to connect to Alaska and made their way down here. And if people want to be called Native American, or Chinese American or what ever have you, then I want to be called European American since I am Polish, German, and Italian.
    *(All of this should be taken with fun, since I am not trying to put down anyone or different races or cultures.)

  • Jonathon | March 7, 2007 at 12:15 pm |

    Cal State Chico = Wildcats
    Cal State San Luis Obispo (Cal Poly) = Mustangs

  • tessa | March 7, 2007 at 12:16 pm |

    [quote comment=”58884″] I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended…

    …I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.[/quote]

    I know this issue has been discussed multiple times on this board, so I will keep it as short as possible. However, I have to speak to this theory that just because the dominant culture says it would not mind if the tables were turned makes it OK to do whatever we want to minority cultures. Fact is, people of European descent have not been systematically oppressed, killed, marginalized, and disrespected as Native Americans have been (and still are) in this country.

    The stereotypes that are used to represent the sports teams’ “Indians” are the same stereotypes that were used to justify treating them as less than human, and therefore justify killing or relocating them for our own convenience. It is a lot easier to have a sense of humor about lederhosen when your people have never been oppressed for wearing them.

  • todd krevanchi | March 7, 2007 at 12:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”58889″]Yesterday’s IHSA theme got me thinking back to the greatest time in the original march madness. Only two teams left (that I know of) have sleeves on their jerseys. My alma Matter Batavia (NBA HOFamer Dan Issel,Super bowl QB Ken Anderson, Lamar Justice, Corey Williams and TNT Analyst Craig Seger) and the alma matter of Michael Finley, Doc Rivers, Dee and Shannon Brown and Brian Carwell Proviso East. They both are beautiful. To this day.[/quote]

    as one who sported the t-shirt under the jersey during my entire basketball career, i appreciated the comment on the short sleeve jerseys. i always looked forward to the ncaa tourney in the late 80’s early 90’s to see evansville and their short sleeve shirts…

    [quote comment=”58891″]The Gaucho Locos were originally known as the Gauchoholics but changed its name due to negative connotations.
    [/quote]

    negative connotations of what? what the heck is gauchohol anyway? i hate when people say they are a workaholic or a chocoholic. what the heck is workahol or chocahol… so when you become addicted to something all of a sudden you just add the last 3 syllables of alcoholic to it?

    just because it works for 1 term, doesnt mean it works for all…

  • Metsfan AZ | March 7, 2007 at 12:17 pm |

    Has anyone seen the new BP caps?

  • Anthony | March 7, 2007 at 12:18 pm |

    [quote comment=”58883″][quote comment=”58882″]Am I going to have to be the first person to extol the virtues of the “Indians” nickname, given that they named the whole team after Louis Sockalexis, an 1890s star from the Penobscot tribe?

    If you want to dump that silly-looking Chief Wahoo logo for something more dignified, like the Blackhawks’ logo, or the Braves tomahawk — admitting that I have no idea whether or not the Penobscot actually used tomahawks — well, that’s fine. But the name Indians is not demeaning in the least. It’s the exact opposite, and the fact that people want it changed without considering Cleveland baseball history seems to be a classic example of the triumph of politics over truth.

    I do not have the link here but I think this is not true. It was discussed in previous posts.[/quote]

    Not to mention that the term “Indian” is completely incorrect. Was Louis Sockalexis from India? And are you advocating that baseball history is more important than taking into account whether something is offensive to Native Americans? Or any other group of people for that matter?[/quote]

    I agree: there’s really nothing wrong with using terms like “Brave” (an heroic, complimentary term) or “Fighting Sioux” (specifying a tribe), or using a particular tribe name with that tribe’s blessing (as the University of Utah has done).

    But using something like “Indian” (widely discredited as inaccurate and even mildly offensive) and “Redskin?” I think that’s inappropriate. I once read an article explaining the original, non-offensive meaning behind the term “Redskin,” but most Americans view that as an antiquated term from older, more poorly-educated days. Imagine if there was a team named the “Darkies” who used an African-American as its mascot–who wouldn’t be offended (aside from troglodytes and racists)? I realize that this is a drastic example, but it seems to be along the same lines. Why not refer to the Redskins as the Potomacs or the Indians as the Penobscots? That’s much more fitting.

  • Fursty | March 7, 2007 at 12:18 pm |

    All Cal Baseball position players wear the quarterback wristbands, and use them when receiving signs from the coach.

  • Aaron | March 7, 2007 at 12:19 pm |

    It’s nice to see this site running much faster after the hosting change debacle. I think the increased speed definitely offsets the few days of downtime.

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 12:25 pm |

    You are right Tessa. Point very well taken. If a Native American tribe finds something offensive in a college using them as a mascot, they have the right to try and stop it. For instance the Sioux tribe of ND don’t like the college using them as a mascot, but the Seminole tribes of Florida love the fact they are used as FSU’s mascot. To each his/her own I guess.

  • WVU Tom | March 7, 2007 at 12:31 pm |

    It seems like the team naming issue (i.e. Indians) is a lot like the abortion issue–most people feel very strongly one way or the other, but at the same are able to recognize valid arguments made by the opposing side. It’s also probably an issue that will never be settled on this board.

    Regardless of where you stand, however, I think most should agree that Chief Wahoo should probably go away–even if he was created by an authentic native american (which I doubt, but I put it out there just in case).

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 12:33 pm |

    Was strolling through the ISU athletics site today…ended up looking at softball pictures.

    The white jerseys are acceptable, check out those stirrups!

    The red, however, are overbearing. Perhaps follow the club baseball team and go with white pants?! I know I’ve posted the baseball pic before, but like always, ignore the guys in sweats and flipflops, it’s a club team.

    I’m not sure why I don’t like the softball red uni’s, since I really like the wrestling warm-ups in all red.

    I haven’t been able to get a picture of the 1977 throwbacks that’ll be worn in September, if someone can help me out that’d be great!

  • Chad G | March 7, 2007 at 12:34 pm |

    Ha! Eric Kuselias is filling in on the Herd today and he is currently making fun of the new Nike Uni’s for FLorida, Ohio State etc…

    He equated the the shorts to MC hammer pants cut off at the ankle

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 12:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”58901″]Has anyone seen the new BP caps?[/quote

    nice

  • Jim | March 7, 2007 at 12:46 pm |

    [quote comment=”58880″]I know there is not a lot about Division III hoops on here, but I just have to vent for a while. (I promise I will add some uni-related info later)

    How is it that a team ranked #5 in the nation in D3 hoops doesn’t make it into their version of the Big Dance? I am talking about University of Wisconsin Oshkosh. When the selection process happened, the Titans were ranked 5th overall in the nation, and because they did not win the Conference Tournament, they did not get the automatic bid into the tourney. Nor did they get an “At Large bid” which is given to a few teams that have produced a strong season, but didn’t win the conference tourney. Instead of the board just saying, “Sorry you don’t get a #1 seed.” They say, “Sorry, your season is over”. In the whole scheme of things, this is the equivalent of Butler not making it to the Big Dance. They are ranked #17 in the nation, but didn’t win their conference tourney, so according to D3 rules, they would not be invited to the Big Dance. I guess you can also say this is like a team like Memphis or Texas A&M not making it either. (Then again we don’t know if they will win their conference tourney yet, but you get the idea)Having a team ranked at the end of the season and not making it in the Big Dance (In any division) it a travesty.

    And to prove how un-biased I am. I am from Stevens Point, which of course is home to University of Wisconsin Stevens Point Pointers, the current #1 team in D3 basketball (WInners of the 2004, and 2005 National Championship) and conference rival of Oshkosh. The Point I am trying to make, I guess, is that if this was D1, it would be a huge deal, but because it is D3, no one really cares.

    Now on to that uni stuff I promised. The Pointers of UWSP have for years copied the Lakers in the script on their jerseys. It has bugged me since I was young. Not that I don’t like it. But I wish they had something original.

    Laker copy cats[/quote]

    If they expanded back to 64 teams, this probably wouldn’t be a problem. I don’t know why they cut back the number of teams.

  • hot rodd | March 7, 2007 at 1:00 pm |

    there are new bp caps?

  • bj in gainesville | March 7, 2007 at 1:03 pm |

    [quote comment=”58887″][quote comment=”58881″][quote comment=”58878″][quote comment=”58852″]Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.[/quote]
    Everyone is bent out of shape about the undershirts, but remember that was just a press release photo, not an actual shot of in game use. Florida has already worn the blue version of these (on 2/27 vs. Tenn) with no odd sleeves and little fanfare. In OSU’s case, though the pants are a bit much in the length department, they are an improvement over the piped and striped train-wreck they are currently wearing.[/quote]

    From the Nike System of Dress website (Designer Q & A section):

    Florida debuted the uniforms on February 27 and they did not look as drastic as I’ve seen in some pictures from Nike. Why not?

    The Nike Pro Compression base layer that was developed for each university was not ready when Florida decided to debut its new uniform over a week early against Tennessee.[/quote]
    GREAT insight. Of course I am a little worried about what we’ll see now with the undershirts. If nothing stupid happens there, the

    new OSU’s unis are still an upgrade.[/quote]

    Florida has been wearing the same solid-colored undershirts they’ve worn all season long. Most players wear tight, sleeveless shirts under their unis. Corey Brewer being the most obvious exception. He wears a plain t-shirt (loose, not tight) so I don’t really see him going to the tight baselayer, but with Nike, who knows. The other guys will probably wear the sleeveless SoD undershirt, which you won’t really be able to see. I really hope no one busts out the long sleeves.

  • jesse | March 7, 2007 at 1:05 pm |

    [quote comment=”58886″]is it just me or is it a bit contradictory to relate the negro leagues (or any other segregated league) with civil rights in this circumstance?

    i mean, wasnt the whole basis of the civil rights movement (in a sports sense anyway) to show just how ridiculous separate leagues were?

    hey, still celebrate the history and great players of the negro leagues by having the negro league throwback days… i think its necessary.

    but for mlb to issue a statement saying that the unis for a “civil rights” game are based on that of a league which segregated individuals, and offered no civil rights absolutely baffles my mind!!! was this statement thought out? are they really that insensitive?

    am i right or wrong here?[/quote]

    I am not a Native American, nor did I go to a school or root for a pro team that uses a Native American as a mascot. I don’t care about it, personally I think its much ado about nothing, generally involving well intentioned people focusing on a trivial matter to bring attention to an important cause.

    I think that if the Univ. of Illinois, North Dakota or Florida State want to use their names that’s fine, but they should have to demonstrate what they do every year to provide assistance to Native Americans that live in abject poverty in this country. I think about 10 full scholarships a year would do the trick nicely.

    Pro teams, same (although more expensive) deal, new schools, running water, literacy programs. The Redskins don’t change their name because they make money with it, that’s fine. But they should have to help the people whose traditions they purport to honor.

  • jkads | March 7, 2007 at 1:05 pm |

    [quote comment=”58913″][quote comment=”58887″][quote comment=”58881″][quote comment=”58878″][quote comment=”58852″]Regarding the nike basketball abominations, does the NCAA have a rule regarding undershirts? I’m pretty sure the national high school rules state that any undershirt worn must be the same color as the jersey and must be a solid color. I can deal with the tight effect I guess, but if these players start coming out with these ridiculous long-sleeve get-ups…I don’t know what to say.[/quote]
    Everyone is bent out of shape about the undershirts, but remember that was just a press release photo, not an actual shot of in game use. Florida has already worn the blue version of these (on 2/27 vs. Tenn) with no odd sleeves and little fanfare. In OSU’s case, though the pants are a bit much in the length department, they are an improvement over the piped and striped train-wreck they are currently wearing.[/quote]

    From the Nike System of Dress website (Designer Q & A section):

    Florida debuted the uniforms on February 27 and they did not look as drastic as I’ve seen in some pictures from Nike. Why not?

    The Nike Pro Compression base layer that was developed for each university was not ready when Florida decided to debut its new uniform over a week early against Tennessee.[/quote]
    GREAT insight. Of course I am a little worried about what we’ll see now with the undershirts. If nothing stupid happens there, the

    new OSU’s unis are still an upgrade.[/quote]

    Florida has been wearing the same solid-colored undershirts they’ve worn all season long. Most players wear tight, sleeveless shirts under their unis. Corey Brewer being the most obvious exception. He wears a plain t-shirt (loose, not tight) so I don’t really see him going to the tight baselayer, but with Nike, who knows. The other guys will probably wear the sleeveless SoD undershirt, which you won’t really be able to see. I really hope no one busts out the long sleeves.[/quote]

    I think it would be fun to see someone bust out the long sleeves. I like things that can be customized and are different. I might take that back once I see it actually implemented during a game. We shall see…

  • bj in gainesville | March 7, 2007 at 1:08 pm |

    I just realized that the first link I posted shows one of my biggest pet-peeves regarding the Gators’ BBall unis: the shoes in two colors. The team needs to pick either blue or orange. Switch em up, I don’t care, but wearing both on the court at the same time, especially when its 4-1 orange to blue, looks a little too High School for me.

  • Jason | March 7, 2007 at 1:15 pm |

    As a life-long Indians fan I have heard all of the complaints and comebacks about the nickname and Chief Wahoo, and as a life-long Indians fan I would have no problem if they changed their nickname. Just think about it, they would gain some positive nickname publicity, I would have a great excuse to buy new hats, jerseys, etc…, and we would have new uniforms to discuss! It’s a win-win-win situation.

    So, instead of saying how wrong the nickname is, what are some suggestions for a new nickname for Cleveland’s baseball club?

    I would like to see them go back to the 19th century and revive the Spiders.

  • Bud | March 7, 2007 at 1:15 pm |

    How about this one….

    I’m Irish and the Notre Dame mascot and name completely offend me as it is a stereotype that is negative toward my heritage. It must go.

    Really though, big deal, I just hate Notre Dame. Mostly for Rick Mirer destroying the Seahawks, but that isn’t the point here.

  • jesse | March 7, 2007 at 1:29 pm |

    [quote comment=”58918″]How about this one….

    I’m Irish and the Notre Dame mascot and name completely offend me as it is a stereotype that is negative toward my heritage. It must go.

    Really though, big deal, I just hate Notre Dame. Mostly for Rick Mirer destroying the Seahawks, but that isn’t the point here.[/quote]

    It seems funny, but the analogy is perfect. The nickname comes from a newspaper reporter that said “those guys fight like a bunch of drunken irishmen”. It was a backhanded compliment that the school used as a badge of honor. And because there are a lot of Irish Catholics. But it is completely based on a negative stereotype of the Irish.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:29 pm |

    [quote comment=”58912″]there are new bp caps?[/quote]
    I guess, I wonder what they look like?

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:34 pm |

    This is probably the best uni Texas has worn on the playing field, minus Rockhead of course.

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | March 7, 2007 at 1:34 pm |

    not sure if anyone picked up on this based on yesterdays ihsa report.
    if you look at chicago’s king high school’s unis from 1990, you will see that they had the tight spandex shorts and the loose shirts. an exact opposite of the current trend.
    http://www.marchmadn...

    if you view the documentary hoop dreams, you can see these uni’s in action. VERY awkward to look at.

  • skott | March 7, 2007 at 1:35 pm |

    i’m a citizen of the united states. i’ve always hated just calling it america. America is the Continent (north and south), the country is the US.

    here’s the deal – the Indians, redskins, the Braves, aztecs, the chiefs…all this stuff is just not cool.

    spartans and trojans i’m not sure of, to be honest, i never gave it much thought. i guess its probably the same principal, maybe.
    but then they were civilizations from several thousand years ago and not one that is still caricatured only 120 years after it was hunted and wiped off of its own land.

    to me it seems like Redskins is not appropriate in ANY way no matter where you fall on this issue.

    as for the indians, if they are gonna have that inflamitory logo they get what they deserve.

    which should mean NOT playing a civil rights game.

    just my opinion.

  • tessa | March 7, 2007 at 1:36 pm |

    [quote comment=”58905″]You are right Tessa. Point very well taken. If a Native American tribe finds something offensive in a college using them as a mascot, they have the right to try and stop it. For instance the Sioux tribe of ND don’t like the college using them as a mascot, but the Seminole tribes of Florida love the fact they are used as FSU’s mascot. To each his/her own I guess.[/quote]

    I agree – if you are sanctioned by the tribe, I can see it being a positive force, especially if they are involved in the portrayal. Then it is a force for good, and I am totally for it. I think it is less the use of an American Indian as a mascot and more about the use of stereotypes.

    Thanks for listening (reading?) – I was worried that you would take what I said as an attack, and I am glad that you are a believer in fair and open discourse. :)

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:37 pm |

    Hey the D’Backs jersey doesn’t look too bad actually. The red will look affective at night games.

  • WVU Tom | March 7, 2007 at 1:38 pm |

    [quote comment=”58918″]How about this one….

    I’m Irish and the Notre Dame mascot and name completely offend me as it is a stereotype that is negative toward my heritage. It must go.

    Really though, big deal, I just hate Notre Dame. Mostly for Rick Mirer destroying the Seahawks, but that isn’t the point here.[/quote]

    Good point, it does make me wonder why so much focus is pointed toward native american based nicknames, and not just all “ethnicity-based” nicknames. Granted, there is an Irish history at Notre Dame, and in that history validity for the nickname, but it is the same type of argument many post regarding native american mascoted teams.

    BTW–I’m NOT suggesting that ND change thier mascot or nickname, just pointing out the double-standard in the whole argument.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:39 pm |
  • Tom | March 7, 2007 at 1:39 pm |

    It truly pains me to say this but, Nike’s new version for the Ohio State University is a distinct improvement over the ones they’re currently wearing. If only because the current ones are such horrible monstrosities. There seems to be only one other positive, that the ridiculous, “team Nike” yoke across the front of the jersey has been banished to the dustbin of history.

  • Mark in Shiga | March 7, 2007 at 1:41 pm |

    Jkads, the Indians’ official site disagrees with Wikipedia’s slightly biased coverage (which, significantly, fails to mentioned that Sockalexis had passed away in the year preceding the new name). I remember reading about Sockalexis in “The ’99 Spiders” and “On A Clear Day They Could See Seventh Place”; highly recommended.

    And Specs, I embarrassedly admit that I hadn’t considered that the word “Indian” is, in a geographical sense, wrong. Wrong technically, but not morally — calling the team the “Indians” is no sin and certainly isn’t anything to disqualify them from playing in a civil-rights-related exhibition.

    If anything, Cleveland, having integrated a Native American on their team in an age where racial intolerance was a fact of life, deserves its place in this exhibition game more than most.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:41 pm |

    Hate the block letters, why wouldn’t they go with the writing of the word Nationals, to match the W on the ball cap??..!

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 1:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”58917″]As a life-long Indians fan I have heard all of the complaints and comebacks about the nickname and Chief Wahoo, and as a life-long Indians fan I would have no problem if they changed their nickname. Just think about it, they would gain some positive nickname publicity, I would have a great excuse to buy new hats, jerseys, etc…, and we would have new uniforms to discuss! It’s a win-win-win situation.

    So, instead of saying how wrong the nickname is, what are some suggestions for a new nickname for Cleveland’s baseball club?

    I would like to see them go back to the 19th century and revive the Spiders.[/quote]
    I like the ‘Spiders’ suggestion. Good uni possibilities there.

    Or you could go with the ‘Flaming Cuyahogas’

  • Kim | March 7, 2007 at 1:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”58925″]Hey the D’Backs jersey doesn’t look too bad actually. The red will look affective at night games.[/quote]

    That’s the BP jersey.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 1:43 pm |

    For someone who’s hated by the fans, he seems pretty popular to me, even to cross state rivals.

  • dilbert719 | March 7, 2007 at 1:44 pm |

    [quote comment=”58869″][quote comment=”58861″]

    If MLB could work out a “cause” as the reason why it has staged games in Japan, Mexico, and Puerto Rico, it would.[/quote]

    Oooh. I can’t wait for the Mariners/Dodgers “Internment Camp” game.

    Or the Diamondbacks/A’s in the “Migrant Worker” Game.

    Or the Nationals/Yankees in the “You’re just a Territory” Game.[/quote]

    The Nationals already play 81 “Just a territory” games every year. What difference would another one make? *Insert longwinded, angry “DC residents are second-class citizens” rant here*

  • Metsfan AZ | March 7, 2007 at 1:48 pm |

    [quote comment=”58927″]Louuuuuuuuuu[/quote]
    10 innings?? It’s March…

  • WVU Tom | March 7, 2007 at 1:49 pm |

    [quote comment=”58925″]Hey the D’Backs jersey doesn’t look too bad actually. The red will look affective at night games.[/quote]

    They look much better than the old ones (IMO). I’m just sick of the whole “Hey, let’s change our uniforms to red!” trend that seems to be sweeping the professional sports world. Be original people!

    [quote comment=”58930″]Hate the block letters, why wouldn’t they go with the writing of the word Nationals, to match the W on the ball cap??..![/quote]

    Hate that too, as a DC resident, I was real disappointed a few years ago when that design was announced. Very uninspired if you ask me. I do like that fact that the Nats wear different primary colors on the road and at home, while still maintaining a (very appropriate for DC) red, white, and blue color scheme.

  • dilbert719 | March 7, 2007 at 1:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”58934″][quote comment=”58869″][quote comment=”58861″]

    If MLB could work out a “cause” as the reason why it has staged games in Japan, Mexico, and Puerto Rico, it would.[/quote]

    Oooh. I can’t wait for the Mariners/Dodgers “Internment Camp” game.

    Or the Diamondbacks/A’s in the “Migrant Worker” Game.

    Or the Nationals/Yankees in the “You’re just a Territory” Game.[/quote]

    The Nationals already play 81 “Just a territory” games every year. What difference would another one make? *Insert longwinded, angry “DC residents are second-class citizens” rant here*[/quote]

    And, interestingly enough, the rest of my post disappeared. Probably a bad idea to use greater than and less than symbols. Just summing up: DC gets the shaft on voting rights, and all they really have to be proud of is the Redskins. Probably the most fair way to take away the one thing they’re proud of is to give them something else to be proud of, primarily the right to vote in Congress.

    Jesse’s idea in post 77 was fantastic.

    As for renaming Cleveland’s team, please, anything but the Spiders. That name always struck me as a terrible idea.

    And on the subject of derogatory names, I’m surprised we made it this far without a mention of the Atlanta Crackers. That usually shows up about 10, 20 posts in.

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 1:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”58933″]For someone who’s hated by the fans, he seems pretty popular to me, even to cross state rivals.[/quote]
    Man, look at the size of those feet!

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 1:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”58902″]But using something like “Indian” (widely discredited as inaccurate and even mildly offensive) and “Redskin?” I think that’s inappropriate. I once read an article explaining the original, non-offensive meaning behind the term “Redskin,” but most Americans view that as an antiquated term from older, more poorly-educated days. Imagine if there was a team named the “Darkies” who used an African-American as its mascot–who wouldn’t be offended (aside from troglodytes and racists)? I realize that this is a drastic example, but it seems to be along the same lines. Why not refer to the Redskins as the Potomacs or the Indians as the Penobscots? That’s much more fitting.[/quote]

    Fellow Anthony, let me point you here regarding a product that today is considered offensive (or is in use today, but not in the USA):

    http://en.wikipedia....

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 1:54 pm |

    [quote comment=”58935″][quote comment=”58927″]Louuuuuuuuuu[/quote]
    10 innings?? It’s March…[/quote]

    MetsFan, I believe that it’s up to the teams and the umpires if the game should continue into extra innings. If the teams have extra pitchers, I believe, is the controlling question. (They’ll play an extra inning or two if pitchers are available.)

  • Shaftman | March 7, 2007 at 1:55 pm |

    [quote comment=”58938″][quote comment=”58933″]For someone who’s hated by the fans, he seems pretty popular to me, even to cross state rivals.[/quote]
    Man, look at the size of those feet![/quote]

    Q: You know what they say about ballplayers with big feet?

    A: Small & shrivelled balls.

  • Ron | March 7, 2007 at 1:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”58888″][quote comment=”58884″]I don’t understand how Indian mascots (in college or the pros) can be viewed as negative. This topic has pissed me off for a long time. Would it be better if we changed North Dakota to the Fighting Native Americans? And why do teams with the name Warriors have to be changed? i.e. Marquette. Granted the mascot “Willie Whomp-em” was bad, their have been other warriors in history (Trojan, Spartan, Viking). I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended.

    What I am getting act, is that a lot of people can find something derogatory about a lot of mascots. But that is what they are…mascots. Not being portrayed in a negative way, but as a historical reference to that area. Pretty soon The University of California Santa Barbara is going to have to change their nickname because the Fighting Banana Slugs can be portrayed as making fun of the area of California for being slow. Oh, wait… it was changed already. They are now the Gauchos. Oh yeah… a lot better. Yeesh. What’s next?

    I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.[/quote]

    That’s incorrect. UC-Santa Cruz is the Gauchos. UC-Santa Barbara is the Banana Slugs.[/quote]

    You have it reversed, UC Santa Cruz are the Slugs and UC Santa Barbara are the Gauchos.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:04 pm |

    Hopefully the Maple Leafs will go to these if they do indeed modify their uni’s for RBK.
    While in Toronto this past weekend, I was told that it takes 372 stitches to sew on the letters S-U-N-D-I-N. I find that hard to believe as you can clearly see “Sundin” is put on a patch, then sewn on, correct?

  • Greg | March 7, 2007 at 2:05 pm |

    Re: Ethnic based nicknames

    Don’t know if this has been mentioned before. But I was a bull dog in my former life and let me tell you it pissed us off when teams used dogs as mascots, like we were second class citizens or something! Wait until PETA gets ahold of this! The cats I knew didn’t mind teams being named Lions or Tigers, but they’re just stupid cats and were too busy playing with string, you know? Anyway, I demand that all teams stop using any canine based mascot or likeness in a team name or logo. I’m glad this was brought up.

  • Mark in Shiga | March 7, 2007 at 2:09 pm |

    Completely unrelated to the Indians-Cards game is a guy who I really want to see make the majors this year: Taiwanese-born (I think)Chin-Lung Hu of the Dodgers.

    Shortest surname ever to appear on a baseball jersey?

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:12 pm |

    Glad to see you in the desert, as New York swallowed your pride in one gulp.

  • joe | March 7, 2007 at 2:16 pm |

    [quote comment=”58899″][quote comment=”58884″] I am of German heritage, and if some College team changed their nickname to the Deutcheman and portrayed a man in a leaderhosin (sp?) and beer steins acting drunk…I would not be offended…

    …I mean I am not trying to take away from the serious-ness of this subject about Native American Mascots. All I am saying is that I personally don’t think it is a big deal. And like I said, if the tables were turned, I personally wouldn’t mind a college team using my heritage for a mascot. I think it would be cool, and take pride in it.[/quote]

    I know this issue has been discussed multiple times on this board, so I will keep it as short as possible. However, I have to speak to this theory that just because the dominant culture says it would not mind if the tables were turned makes it OK to do whatever we want to minority cultures. Fact is, people of European descent have not been systematically oppressed, killed, marginalized, and disrespected as Native Americans have been (and still are) in this country.

    The stereotypes that are used to represent the sports teams’ “Indians” are the same stereotypes that were used to justify treating them as less than human, and therefore justify killing or relocating them for our own convenience. It is a lot easier to have a sense of humor about lederhosen when your people have never been oppressed for wearing them.[/quote]

    The only way the blackhawks use of an indian head could be derogatory is if you consider that the blackhawks lose all if their battles just likethe indians did. If the indians had won we wouldnt be having these stupid arguments. History is written by the winners, not the losers.

  • Stuby | March 7, 2007 at 2:18 pm |

    [quote comment=”58946″]Completely unrelated to the Indians-Cards game is a guy who I really want to see make the majors this year: Taiwanese-born (I think)Chin-Lung Hu of the Dodgers.

    Shortest surname ever to appear on a baseball jersey?[/quote[quote comment=”58946″]Completely unrelated to the Indians-Cards game is a guy who I really want to see make the majors this year: Taiwanese-born (I think)Chin-Lung Hu of the Dodgers.

    Shortest surname ever to appear on a baseball jersey?[/quote]

    Sadaharu Oh

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:21 pm |

    So do the Phillies and Rangers just exchange jerseys after each game and iron their teamname on them? Hopefully they’re dry-cleaned.

  • joe | March 7, 2007 at 2:26 pm |

    According to SI (via the chicago sun times) 357 NHL’ers were asked what is the best/wrost NHL unis.
    Best:
    1. Chicago 38%
    2. Montreal 16%
    3. Detriot 14%
    4. Toronto 11%
    Worst:
    1. Nashville 28%
    2. Buffalo 24%
    3. Atlanta 8%
    4. Anaheim 7%

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:27 pm |

    Seriously, if this isn’t a good definition of a rubber arm, then I’m clueless.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”58952″]According to SI (via the chicago sun times) 357 NHL’ers were asked what is the best/wrost NHL unis.
    Best:
    1. Chicago 38%
    2. Montreal 16%
    3. Detriot 14%
    4. Toronto 11%
    Worst:
    1. Nashville 28%
    2. Buffalo 24%
    3. Atlanta 8%
    4. Anaheim 7%[/quote]
    I have to disagree with # 3 & 4 for the worst. They ain’t that bad. But then again, it was only 7-8%.

  • Broker75 | March 7, 2007 at 2:35 pm |

    I wonder if Mike Sweeney is gonna have the Captain “C” sewn on his jersey for the reg.season.

  • Kelli | March 7, 2007 at 2:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”58927″]Louuuuuuuuuu[/quote]

    I think the pitcher was aiming for the ugly yellow streak on the side of the jersey, perhaps hoping it would die.

  • joe | March 7, 2007 at 2:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”58954″][quote comment=”58952″]According to SI (via the chicago sun times) 357 NHL’ers were asked what is the best/wrost NHL unis.
    Best:
    1. Chicago 38%
    2. Montreal 16%
    3. Detriot 14%
    4. Toronto 11%
    Worst:
    1. Nashville 28%
    2. Buffalo 24%
    3. Atlanta 8%
    4. Anaheim 7%[/quote]
    I have to disagree with # 3 & 4 for the worst. They ain’t that bad. But then again, it was only 7-8%.[/quote]
    im not sure is its anaheim the worst with 7% of the fav vote, or nashville is the worst with 28% of the worst vote. The suntimes does not clarify it.

  • Teebz | March 7, 2007 at 2:41 pm |

    [quote comment=”58944″]Hopefully the Maple Leafs will go to these if they do indeed modify their uni’s for RBK.
    While in Toronto this past weekend, I was told that it takes 372 stitches to sew on the letters S-U-N-D-I-N. I find that hard to believe as you can clearly see “Sundin” is put on a patch, then sewn on, correct?[/quote]

    The letters are sewn onto the nameplate which is then sewn onto the jersey.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 2:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”58953″]Seriously, if this isn’t a good definition of a rubber arm, then I’m clueless.[/quote]

    I just had a flashback to the wrestler I’ve been treating in the training room for a severely dislocated elbow. But there aren’t too many pictures out there of a pitcher mid-throw that don’t distort the arm.

  • KU Student | March 7, 2007 at 2:45 pm |

    Syracuse game just started and their version of the new unis really don’t look that bad. They basically just look like they have the classic women’s cut to the arm holes. Theirs also aren’t nearly as tight as the ones the Ohio State model is wearing and none of them so far are wearing long sleeves.

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 2:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”58952″]According to SI (via the chicago sun times) 357 NHL’ers were asked what is the best/wrost NHL unis.
    Best:
    1. Chicago 38%
    2. Montreal 16%
    3. Detriot 14%
    4. Toronto 11%
    Worst:
    1. Nashville 28%
    2. Buffalo 24%
    3. Atlanta 8%
    4. Anaheim 7%[/quote]

    The Anaheim jersey is a-ok with me, really. I still wish they just put the webbed-foot “D” on the jersey, though, over “Ducks.”

  • Eric | March 7, 2007 at 2:47 pm |

    ‘Cuse is playing right now in their new unis.
    Let’s see how quickly a pic can be posted.
    Ready. GO!

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 2:48 pm |

    You know…those new ‘Cuse jerseys aren’t that bad. I like the fact that they say “Orange” on the front. The form fitting isn’t that bad either. However…those long/flowing pants are kind of extreme.

  • SaraJane | March 7, 2007 at 2:50 pm |

    If you haven’t seen the new Nike System of Dress unis in action yet, turn on ESPN right now and check out Syracuse. They don’t look too terrible in action; in fact, they kind of makes the Huskies’ jerseys look oversized and sloppy. The shorts do look a little skort-y, though.

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 2:56 pm |

    Why isn’t anyone on Syracuse opting for the undershirts? Either the mid length or long sleeved??

  • Wade | March 7, 2007 at 2:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”58952″]According to SI (via the chicago sun times) 357 NHL’ers were asked what is the best/wrost NHL unis.
    Best:
    1. Chicago 38%
    2. Montreal 16%
    3. Detriot 14%
    4. Toronto 11%
    Worst:
    1. Nashville 28%
    2. Buffalo 24%
    3. Atlanta 8%
    4. Anaheim 7%[/quote]

    If they are talking about the Predators’ mustard jerseys, I will agree, but if they are talking about the standard blues and whites, I have to wonder if all those pucks to the head aren’t finally taking their toll.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 2:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”58965″]Why isn’t anyone on Syracuse opting for the undershirts? Either the mid length or long sleeved??[/quote]

    Because they define “terrible idea”

  • Jamikel | March 7, 2007 at 3:00 pm |

    [quote comment=”58899″]
    I know this issue has been discussed multiple times on this board, so I will keep it as short as possible. However, I have to speak to this theory that just because the dominant culture says it would not mind if the tables were turned makes it OK to do whatever we want to minority cultures. Fact is, people of European descent have not been systematically oppressed, killed, marginalized, and disrespected as Native Americans have been (and still are) in this country.

    The stereotypes that are used to represent the sports teams’ “Indians” are the same stereotypes that were used to justify treating them as less than human, and therefore justify killing or relocating them for our own convenience. It is a lot easier to have a sense of humor about lederhosen when your people have never been oppressed for wearing them.[/quote]

    Quoted just so people can see this again. Absolutely beautifully put.

    And on the Irish example: The big difference there is that the Irish took what was derogatory and made it a sense of pride (kind of like Yankees, if you want to go back far enough.) It’s not offensive based simply on the fact that those targeted are not offended. Another important factor to remember is that the Irish are no longer an oppressed minority group. The greater culture doesn’t even consider them a minority group at all anymore.

  • Kim | March 7, 2007 at 3:02 pm |

    [quote comment=”58961″]

    The Anaheim jersey is a-ok with me, really. I still wish they just put the webbed-foot “D” on the jersey, though, over “Ducks.”[/quote]

    That to me is the sad aspect of the Ducks new unis. They were so close to having a fantastic uniform. But instead of a traditional classic hockey look, they went with a bad beer league look.

    They really ought to ditch the wordmark and go with the logo.

  • Anthony | March 7, 2007 at 3:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”58964″]If you haven’t seen the new Nike System of Dress unis in action yet, turn on ESPN right now and check out Syracuse. They don’t look too terrible in action; in fact, they kind of makes the Huskies’ jerseys look oversized and sloppy. The shorts do look a little skort-y, though.[/quote]

    Yeah, the jerseys don’t look THAT terrible–I think the initial pictures had them fitting far tighter than they do in reality. However, those shorts are pretty terrible. They do look like skirts.

  • tim | March 7, 2007 at 3:15 pm |

    I’m watching the ‘cuse vs Uconn game and those new cuse jerseys are TERRIBLE. they look like guys wearing under armour on top with rediculously baggy shorts. Nike def screwed up this one..

  • Metsfan AZ | March 7, 2007 at 3:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”58970″][quote comment=”58964″]If you haven’t seen the new Nike System of Dress unis in action yet, turn on ESPN right now and check out Syracuse. They don’t look too terrible in action; in fact, they kind of makes the Huskies’ jerseys look oversized and sloppy. The shorts do look a little skort-y, though.[/quote]

    Yeah, the jerseys don’t look THAT terrible–I think the initial pictures had them fitting far tighter than they do in reality. However, those shorts are pretty terrible. They do look like skirts.[/quote]
    Haven’t seen them in action yet myself but all they sound like is the kid at the Y playing in those GINORMOUS streetball shorts and a wife beater/A-shirt.

  • jkads | March 7, 2007 at 3:24 pm |

    Just watched a couple minutes of the Cuse game. The top looks good in my opinion, but as has been said the shorts look way too big to me.

  • Jeff Scott | March 7, 2007 at 3:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”58894″]Interesting fact – the Civil Rights Game will be the first time the Cardinals have worn a uniform with “St. Louis” on it since 1932.

    http://www.baseballh...

    Starting in ’33, and continuing until the present day, the home and road uniforms have featured “Cardinals.”[/quote]

    Actually, the Cards have worn TBTC jerseys with “ST. LOUIS” on the front. I have a couple hanging in my basement. Here’s an example:
    http://i3.ebayimg.co...

    You could say that, technically, those aren’t Cardinals jerseys, they’re Negro League throwback jerseys. Of course, technically, the Civil Rights game is just a preseason game.

  • Micah | March 7, 2007 at 3:31 pm |

    Yeah, the Orange’s unis don’t look as bad as those intial press release pics show. I like the silver stripes on the shoulders and the Orange on the front is nice. Plus, no long-sleeve tops on any of the players. As everyone is saying, the shorts do look still too long though. I like baggy, but then, there is something to be said for skirt-like length!

  • Jeff Scott | March 7, 2007 at 3:33 pm |

    [quote comment=”58886″]is it just me or is it a bit contradictory to relate the negro leagues (or any other segregated league) with civil rights in this circumstance?

    i mean, wasnt the whole basis of the civil rights movement (in a sports sense anyway) to show just how ridiculous separate leagues were?

    hey, still celebrate the history and great players of the negro leagues by having the negro league throwback days… i think its necessary.

    but for mlb to issue a statement saying that the unis for a “civil rights” game are based on that of a league which segregated individuals, and offered no civil rights absolutely baffles my mind!!! was this statement thought out? are they really that insensitive?

    am i right or wrong here?[/quote]

    Todd, my thoughts exactly. I was going to write that, but you already said it better than I could. I can’t believe MLB issued that statement.

  • Michael Churchill | March 7, 2007 at 3:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”58946″]Completely unrelated to the Indians-Cards game is a guy who I really want to see make the majors this year: Taiwanese-born (I think)Chin-Lung Hu of the Dodgers.

    Shortest surname ever to appear on a baseball jersey?[/quote]

    This is one of those little things that bug me… the way that most, if not all, for the baseball media are ignorant of the fact that Taiwanese (and Korean) practice is to have the family name first, before the given name.

    For example, the New York Yankees have a pitcher named Wang Chien-Ming and it was Park Chan-Ho who gave up Barry Bonds’ 71st home run in 2001.

  • Chris | March 7, 2007 at 3:47 pm |

    hopefully now that the new nikes unis are actually being worn people will realize they don’t have sleeves, they are just plain ol regular jerseys. I tried saying that for 3 days on 2 different sites, yet all I heard was LONG SLEEVE JERSEYS!!!! AHHHH!!!

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 3:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”58977″][quote comment=”58946″]Completely unrelated to the Indians-Cards game is a guy who I really want to see make the majors this year: Taiwanese-born (I think)Chin-Lung Hu of the Dodgers.

    Shortest surname ever to appear on a baseball jersey?[/quote]

    This is one of those little things that bug me… the way that most, if not all, for the baseball media are ignorant of the fact that Taiwanese (and Korean) practice is to have the family name first, before the given name.

    For example, the New York Yankees have a pitcher named Wang Chien-Ming and it was Park Chan-Ho who gave up Barry Bonds’ 71st home run in 2001.[/quote]

    And sometimes they “flip” their names to be Westernized and sometimes they don’t. (I’ve worked with Japanese people who do tend to Westernize their names to given name-family name.)

  • Madd Matt | March 7, 2007 at 3:57 pm |

    The new ‘cuse jerseys aren’t all that bad. The form fitting looks seems OK. I’m glad no players got crazy and sported any dri-fit (long or short sleeved). Acutally, that makes me think: How comfortable would it be to wear a baggier dri-fit top with a form fitting jersey???

    The shorts however ar too long and way to baggy. Now don’t get me wrong, I don’t want to see a come back of the nut-hugger shorts, but kilts? No thanks…..

  • Vegas4BOC | March 7, 2007 at 3:59 pm |

    More info on the new NCAA unis next year:
    http://www.sportslin...

  • dilbert719 | March 7, 2007 at 3:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”58950″]So do the Phillies and Rangers just exchange jerseys after each game and iron their teamname on them? Hopefully they’re dry-cleaned.[/quote]

    Why not? We seem to exchange players that frequently.

    (Former Phils on the Ranger roster:

    Daniel Haigwood
    Vicente Padilla
    Kevin Millwood
    Robinson Tejeda
    Marlon Byrd
    Kenny Lofton

    Also, Desi Relaford, Bruce Chen, and Matt Kata are Ranger non-roster invitees.

    Former Rangers on the Phils’ roster:

    Adam Eaton
    Fabio Castro
    Antonio Alfonseca
    Jamie Moyer
    Rod Barajas)

  • Madd Matt | March 7, 2007 at 4:07 pm |

    I understand Nike’s thought process with the form fitting tops, but it dosent make sense for extending the length an baggy-ness of the shorts.

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 4:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”58984″][quote comment=”58950″]So do the Phillies and Rangers just exchange jerseys after each game and iron their teamname on them? Hopefully they’re dry-cleaned.[/quote]

    Why not? We seem to exchange players that frequently.

    (Former Phils on the Ranger roster:

    Daniel Haigwood
    Vicente Padilla
    Kevin Millwood
    Robinson Tejeda
    Marlon Byrd
    Kenny Lofton

    Also, Desi Relaford, Bruce Chen, and Matt Kata are Ranger non-roster invitees.

    Former Rangers on the Phils’ roster:

    Adam Eaton
    Fabio Castro
    Antonio Alfonseca
    Jamie Moyer
    Rod Barajas)[/quote]

    And don’t forget Kevin Mench who used to be a Ranger grew up as a Phils fan in Delaware.

  • Anthony Verna | March 7, 2007 at 4:22 pm |

    While there’s talk of the Negro Leagues on the board, I’ll go with this unrelated information.

    Folk singer Chuck Brodsky has a hilarious song about a player from the Cleveland Buckeyes named Eddie Klepp.
    Here’s Chuck Brodsky’s website info:
    http://chuckbrodsky....
    http://chuckbrodsky.... (Song clip from his website)

  • Colin Morton | March 7, 2007 at 4:36 pm |

    Ben wrote: [quote comment=”58839″]The Leafs had a Home Depot patch on their jerseys for the outdoor practice because the Leafs and Home Depot had a joint venture to revitalize the old outdoor rink in Etobicoke, just outside of Toronto (where the practice was held). If you can find an image of the rink itself, you’ll see the boards are decorated with Leafs and Home Dep. advertising.
    So while you child is taking his first strides on his skates, he’ll know where to go for his home renovation needs, and who to cheer for if he likes having his heart broken by mediocrity.[/quote]

  • Miguel | March 7, 2007 at 4:37 pm |

    I know I’m in the minority, but I don’t think the new uniforms look half bad.

  • Philly Bill | March 7, 2007 at 4:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”58959″][quote comment=”58953″]Seriously, if this isn’t a good definition of a rubber arm, then I’m clueless.[/quote]

    I just had a flashback to the wrestler I’ve been treating in the training room for a severely dislocated elbow. But there aren’t too many pictures out there of a pitcher mid-throw that don’t distort the arm.[/quote]

    Shouse is a submariner of sorts; his delivery is kind of like this guy’s was, but not as far underhand as this guy’s.

    You can see in this photo that Nomar Garciaparra is also altering his cap to mimic a BP cap by drawing in that silver panel on the side. Note that it doesn’t have the white piping to set off the silver panel, nor the silver rim around the tip of the bill. However, it should be said that he’s done a much better job altering the hat than Jeff Kent did.

  • Philly Bill | March 7, 2007 at 4:37 pm |

    I meant an ST cap, not a BP cap.

  • jesse | March 7, 2007 at 4:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”58990″]I know I’m in the minority, but I don’t think the new uniforms look half bad.[/quote]

    The top looks like a “wife beater”

  • Scott | March 7, 2007 at 4:45 pm |

    the Indians were the first AL team to have a black player, Larry Doby. So, while the team name probly needs to go at this point, we still were progressive in the civil rights front regarding african-americans.

  • Matt | March 7, 2007 at 4:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”58992″]I meant an ST cap, not a BP cap.[/quote]

    They use the hats for BP too, and the correct term according to MLB is BP hat… so you were right originally…

  • Marcus Tonti | March 7, 2007 at 4:47 pm |

    Do the new Nike shorts look like skirts in actual game play, or just in the publicity materials?

  • BIG matt | March 7, 2007 at 4:48 pm |

    [quote comment=”58922″]not sure if anyone picked up on this based on yesterdays ihsa report.
    if you look at chicago’s king high school’s unis from 1990, you will see that they had the tight spandex shorts and the loose shirts. an exact opposite of the current trend.
    http://www.marchmadn...

    if you view the documentary hoop dreams, you can see these uni’s in action. VERY awkward to look at.[/quote]
    Nobody had baggy shorts in 1990

  • Jamikel | March 7, 2007 at 4:48 pm |

    On a somewhat related note, am I the only one who has never thought about Derek Jeter as being African American before? I mean, talk about your one-drop rule…

  • Kerry | March 7, 2007 at 4:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”58930″]Hate the block letters, why wouldn’t they go with the writing of the word Nationals, to match the W on the ball cap??..![/quote]
    Um…what is he doing with that guy’s head?!

  • Matthew S. | March 7, 2007 at 4:58 pm |

    Someone earlier mentioned that schools or teams that use names like Sioux, Seminoles, etc. should do so only if they give a contribution to the tribe. While this isn’t a terrible idea, I would remind whoever made the suggestion that not all Native Americans/Indian tribes are doing poorly. The Seminole tribe of Florida (which incidentally has a very close and supportive relationship with Florida State) recently purchased all Hard Rock Casinos and Hotels for nearly $1 billion: http://www.msnbc.msn...

    I think they’re doing ok.

    Now of course not all tribes have been as successful. Some experience 20-30% unemployment rates. Some do indeed live in squalor and alcoholism has shredded the social fabric of some tribal communities, but to say that these problems could be fixed through ‘contributions’ from teams or universities or by changing the name of a team from ‘Indians’ or ‘Braves’ to something else I think is a bit simplistic and glib.

    What about universities like William & Mary (nickname ‘The Tribe’), which incorporates feathers into the university’s athletic logo: https://www.ticketre...

    Is this offensive? Where do we draw the line?

    Actually with all the talk of ‘Native Americans’ and just what that means, I’m reminded of the movie ‘Gangs of New York’ when Daniel Day Lewis’s character led a gang of ‘Natives’ (that is people of Anglo-Dutch ancestry dating from the 17th century) against the ‘invading hordes of Irish’.

    Food for thought.

  • todd krevanchi | March 7, 2007 at 5:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”58998″][quote comment=”58922″]not sure if anyone picked up on this based on yesterdays ihsa report.
    if you look at chicago’s king high school’s unis from 1990, you will see that they had the tight spandex shorts and the loose shirts. an exact opposite of the current trend.
    http://www.marchmadn...

    if you view the documentary hoop dreams, you can see these uni’s in action. VERY awkward to look at.[/quote]
    Nobody had baggy shorts in 1990[/quote]

    youre right, you just made my point. nobody had spandex shorts and a baggy top.
    it is the exact opposite of this new system of dress tight top baggy shorts…
    just look at that picture. trust me, king wore spandex shorts that season…

  • joe | March 7, 2007 at 5:04 pm |

    [quote comment=”59001″]Someone earlier mentioned that schools or teams that use names like Sioux, Seminoles, etc. should do so only if they give a contribution to the tribe. While this isn’t a terrible idea, I would remind whoever made the suggestion that not all Native Americans/Indian tribes are doing poorly. The Seminole tribe of Florida (which incidentally has a very close and supportive relationship with Florida State) recently purchased all Hard Rock Casinos and Hotels for nearly $1 billion: http://www.msnbc.msn...

    I think they’re doing ok.

    Now of course not all tribes have been as successful. Some experience 20-30% unemployment rates. Some do indeed live in squalor and alcoholism has shredded the social fabric of some tribal communities, but to say that these problems could be fixed through ‘contributions’ from teams or universities or by changing the name of a team from ‘Indians’ or ‘Braves’ to something else I think is a bit simplistic and glib.

    What about universities like William & Mary (nickname ‘The Tribe’), which incorporates feathers into the university’s athletic logo: https://www.ticketre...

    Is this offensive? Where do we draw the line?

    Actually with all the talk of ‘Native Americans’ and just what that means, I’m reminded of the movie ‘Gangs of New York’ when Daniel Day Lewis’s character led a gang of ‘Natives’ (that is people of Anglo-Dutch ancestry dating from the 17th century) against the ‘invading hordes of Irish’.

    Food for thought.[/quote]

    And this is the fault of society that they *choose* to drink themselves to death? They can just as easily leave a reservation and become useful members of society. No one is forcing them to live in squalid reservations. They are all free to leave and live anywhere they please.

  • todd krevanchi | March 7, 2007 at 5:05 pm |

    [quote comment=”58976″][quote comment=”58886″]is it just me or is it a bit contradictory to relate the negro leagues (or any other segregated league) with civil rights in this circumstance?

    i mean, wasnt the whole basis of the civil rights movement (in a sports sense anyway) to show just how ridiculous separate leagues were?

    hey, still celebrate the history and great players of the negro leagues by having the negro league throwback days… i think its necessary.

    but for mlb to issue a statement saying that the unis for a “civil rights” game are based on that of a league which segregated individuals, and offered no civil rights absolutely baffles my mind!!! was this statement thought out? are they really that insensitive?

    am i right or wrong here?[/quote]

    Todd, my thoughts exactly. I was going to write that, but you already said it better than I could. I can’t believe MLB issued that statement.[/quote]

    i actually have half a mind to send something to the mlb offices about this… they really dropped the ball on this one… shit like this really bothers me…
    so if anyone has the email addy as to where this should go, lemme know…

  • Tim | March 7, 2007 at 5:09 pm |

    [quote comment=”58990″]I know I’m in the minority, but I don’t think the new uniforms look half bad.[/quote]

    they look like a sleevless t-shirt they bought at abercrombie and wrote orange on..terrible!!

  • Johnny O | March 7, 2007 at 5:17 pm |

    So if what the ‘Cuse wore today are the new Nike uni’s that everyone was dreading…but then the majority (on here at least) seem not to mind them… then what did we see about a week ago with Florida’s uni’s? Yes, they had the gator print, and different styling, but they were not form fitting on top, and not excessively baggy in the shorts…so what were they? A kind of transition stage until the new Nike ones arrived?

  • Matthew S. | March 7, 2007 at 5:18 pm |

    [quote comment=”59004″][quote comment=”59001″]Someone earlier mentioned that schools or teams that use names like Sioux, Seminoles, etc. should do so only if they give a contribution to the tribe. While this isn’t a terrible idea, I would remind whoever made the suggestion that not all Native Americans/Indian tribes are doing poorly. The Seminole tribe of Florida (which incidentally has a very close and supportive relationship with Florida State) recently purchased all Hard Rock Casinos and Hotels for nearly $1 billion: http://www.msnbc.msn...

    I think they’re doing ok.

    Now of course not all tribes have been as successful. Some experience 20-30% unemployment rates. Some do indeed live in squalor and alcoholism has shredded the social fabric of some tribal communities, but to say that these problems could be fixed through ‘contributions’ from teams or universities or by changing the name of a team from ‘Indians’ or ‘Braves’ to something else I think is a bit simplistic and glib.

    What about universities like William & Mary (nickname ‘The Tribe’), which incorporates feathers into the university’s athletic logo: https://www.ticketre...

    Is this offensive? Where do we draw the line?

    Actually with all the talk of ‘Native Americans’ and just what that means, I’m reminded of the movie ‘Gangs of New York’ when Daniel Day Lewis’s character led a gang of ‘Natives’ (that is people of Anglo-Dutch ancestry dating from the 17th century) against the ‘invading hordes of Irish’.

    Food for thought.[/quote]

    And this is the fault of society that they *choose* to drink themselves to death? They can just as easily leave a reservation and become useful members of society. No one is forcing them to live in squalid reservations. They are all free to leave and live anywhere they please.[/quote]

    I wasn’t assigning blame one way or the other, I was simply saying how it is.

    My larger point is that some tribal communities, like the Seminole, are doing quite well. Others are not and no amount of ‘contributions’ from professional sports teams or universities or name changes by the same will fix or ameliorate any of these problems.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 5:25 pm |

    [quote comment=”58991″][quote comment=”58959″][quote comment=”58953″]Seriously, if this isn’t a good definition of a rubber arm, then I’m clueless.[/quote]

    I just had a flashback to the wrestler I’ve been treating in the training room for a severely dislocated elbow. But there aren’t too many pictures out there of a pitcher mid-throw that don’t distort the arm.[/quote]

    Shouse is a submariner of sorts; his delivery is kind of like this guy’s was, but not as far underhand as this guy’s.

    And in a few years end up here undergoing a process named after this guy, joining the ranks of Wood, Gagne, and Carpenter, among many others.

    Having a “rubber arm” isn’t so much a good thing, as it causes more of a ‘snapping’ action at the elbow when the ball is relased. Instead of having a (relatively) smooth motion, the arm is jerked forward with the elbow as an axis point.

  • Ian K | March 7, 2007 at 5:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”58991″]You can see in this photo that Nomar Garciaparra is also altering his cap to mimic a BP cap by drawing in that silver panel on the side. [/quote]

    I was also curious about why the American flag is at half staff behind Nomar. It is in remembrance of Clem Labine, who died recently. He was a longtime Vero Beach resident – story here

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 5:53 pm |

    Nike has struck at the Iowa Girls Basketball tournament.

    East vs Valley, East is the culprit

  • Brandon Grimm | March 7, 2007 at 6:01 pm |

    I totally agree with Paul that Juan Pierre’s BP hat under his helmet looks weird, but does anyone else find it strange that he would wear a hat under a cool flow helmet? Doesn’t that kind of defete the purpose of the helmet?

  • jkads | March 7, 2007 at 6:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”59013″]Nike has struck at the Iowa Girls Basketball tournament.

    East vs Valley, East is the culprit[/quote]

    Looks like Valley may have pulled a Ron Borges on the Cincinnati Bearcats.

  • Billy B. | March 7, 2007 at 6:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”58889″]Yesterday’s IHSA theme got me thinking back to the greatest time in the original march madness. Only two teams left (that I know of) have sleeves on their jerseys. My alma Matter Batavia (NBA HOFamer Dan Issel,Super bowl QB Ken Anderson, Lamar Justice, Corey Williams and TNT Analyst Craig Seger) and the alma matter of Michael Finley, Doc Rivers, Dee and Shannon Brown and Brian Carwell Proviso East. They both are beautiful. To this day.[/quote]
    I’ve never seen Batavia’s unis but I think that Proviso East has some of the worst uniforms. They have unnecessary black jerseys when they should be just blue and white. The sleeves make the jerseys look bad. It’s fun to watch Proviso play though, they got a senior this year that has to wear some terrible unis when he plays for Kansas State next year.

  • CollinJ | March 7, 2007 at 6:15 pm |

    [quote comment=”59013″]Nike has struck at the Iowa Girls Basketball tournament.

    East vs Valley, East is the culprit[/quote]

    Actually both designs are based off of Nike team designs, but I’m not sure they are actually Nike.

    The Tigers design are based off of the old University of Cincinnati Unis…Complete with the knock-off of the UC logo.

    I doubt though that the uniforms are actually Nike brand…they are most likely a knock off made by another brand. I know there is a brand who’s logo is an S but I can’t remember the name.

  • Judd | March 7, 2007 at 6:31 pm |

    I’ll abstain from the political implication discussions regarding the Civil Rights game, but does anyone know what material the uniforms will be made from? Will they be the old-school flannel or will they be a modern cloth?

    I would guess they should be flannel, but I couldn’t tell by looking at the drawing, nor can I find any pictures.

  • Chuck Ryals | March 7, 2007 at 6:46 pm |

    for those who are complaining that the Indians are in the civil rights game, would it make you happy if the teams were the Angels vs the Padres? :-)

  • Metsfan AZ | March 7, 2007 at 6:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”59018″]I’ll abstain from the political implication discussions regarding the Civil Rights game, but does anyone know what material the uniforms will be made from? Will they be the old-school flannel or will they be a modern cloth?

    I would guess they should be flannel, but I couldn’t tell by looking at the drawing, nor can I find any pictures.[/quote]
    pretty sure all of the throwback type unis are polyester. which mr. lukas will tell you, does NOT give the proper drape. i expect these to be the same. and thanks for keeping it uni related.

  • Paul Lukas | March 7, 2007 at 7:04 pm |

    [quote comment=”59018″]I’ll abstain from the political implication discussions regarding the Civil Rights game, but does anyone know what material the uniforms will be made from? Will they be the old-school flannel or will they be a modern cloth?

    I would guess they should be flannel, but I couldn’t tell by looking at the drawing, nor can I find any pictures.[/quote]

    My biggest gripe about throwback uniforms is that they’re never made from period-appropriate fabric, so they don’t drape properly. Ruins the whole effect.

  • Vegas4BOC | March 7, 2007 at 7:12 pm |

    “but to say that these problems could be fixed through ‘contributions’ from teams or universities or by changing the name of a team from ‘Indians’ or ‘Braves’ to something else I think is a bit simplistic and glib.”

    I find it interesting that schools like Illinois, North & South Dakota, Florida…..all state names based on Native American Indian words, thus the use of indian based mascots, etc. What next, rename the actual State name???? It’s getting out of hand. More excuses for uniform changes, too.

  • Judd | March 7, 2007 at 7:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”59021″][quote comment=”59018″]I’ll abstain from the political implication discussions regarding the Civil Rights game, but does anyone know what material the uniforms will be made from? Will they be the old-school flannel or will they be a modern cloth?

    I would guess they should be flannel, but I couldn’t tell by looking at the drawing, nor can I find any pictures.[/quote]

    My biggest gripe about throwback uniforms is that they’re never made from period-appropriate fabric, so they don’t drape properly. Ruins the whole effect.[/quote]

    Agreed for the most part, but the Red Sox & Pirates played an interleague game in 2003 wearing 1903 World Series throwback unis; the ones they wore that day looked like that itchy flannel and were pretty baggy.

  • Judd | March 7, 2007 at 7:27 pm |

    Here’s a an example form that pirated Red Sox 2003 throwback day – Kenny Lofton isn’t exactly the biggest guy in MLB, and his uni is pretty billowy!

  • Howard | March 7, 2007 at 7:37 pm |

    As a Syracuse alum, I like having the word ORANGE on the jerseys. But the pants (can’t call them shorts) look just plain silly. Not ugly, but silly.

    Oh, and I like the results of the game.

  • S Bennett | March 7, 2007 at 7:40 pm |

    And sometimes they “flip” their names to be Westernized and sometimes they don’t. (I’ve worked with Japanese people who do tend to Westernize their names to given name-family name.)[/quote]

    So, is his family name Long, or Dong?

    SB

  • Billy B. | March 7, 2007 at 7:48 pm |

    [quote comment=”59024″]Here’s a an example form that pirated Red Sox 2003 throwback day – Kenny Lofton isn’t exactly the biggest guy in MLB, and his uni is pretty billowy![/quote]
    The Red Sox 3rd basemen looks weird wearing underarmour with those nice throwback unis.

  • EdfromAZ | March 7, 2007 at 7:49 pm |

    If I organized the Civil Rights game I would:

    Make it a double header in Atlanta where the King Center is located.

    Have the Dodgers (For Jackie Robinson) go up against the Indians (For Larry Doby) in 1947 Throwbacks with the Dodgers in home whites.

    Then the Pittsburgh Pirates (Honoring Roberto Clemente) take on the Braves (honoring Hank Aaron). You folks choose the uniforms.

  • Judd | March 7, 2007 at 7:55 pm |

    [quote comment=”59027″][quote comment=”59024″]Here’s a an example form that pirated Red Sox 2003 throwback day – Kenny Lofton isn’t exactly the biggest guy in MLB, and his uni is pretty billowy![/quote]
    The Red Sox 3rd basemen looks weird wearing underarmour with those nice throwback unis.[/quote]

    That’s third bagger Bill Mueller, another slim player.

    I wonder if MLB will go all out and ask / require the umpires wear throwbacks as well. When they do those throwback games at Fenway, the announcers sometimes even dress in vintage clothes!

  • Elliott | March 7, 2007 at 8:10 pm |

    Didn’t Paul say something another gift card raffle…I think it was a day or two Uni Watch went down…?

  • Travis | March 7, 2007 at 8:25 pm |

    Re: The Civil Rights Game.

    The bigger and much more important question is why the fuck are the Cardinals playing in the game? The Indians I can understand as they had the American Leagues first black player in Larry Doby, but thye fucking Cardinals??!! They had perhaps the single most virulently bigoted and racist player in all of major league baseball at the time in scumsack Enos “Country” Slaughter who was quoted on more then one occasion as saying that “If a nigger ever plays for the Cardinals while I’m here, I’ll kill that nigger myself.”

    Why the fuck aren’t the Dodgers playing in this game?

  • Judd | March 7, 2007 at 8:29 pm |

    [quote comment=”59032″]Re: The Civil Rights Game.

    The bigger and much more important question is why the f**k are the Cardinals playing in the game? The Indians I can understand as they had the American Leagues first black player in Larry Doby, but thye f**king Cardinals??!! They had perhaps the single most virulently bigoted and racist player in all of major league baseball at the time in scumsack Enos “Country” Slaughter who was quoted on more then one occasion as saying that “If a nigger ever plays for the Cardinals while I’m here, I’ll kill that nigger myself.”

    Why the f**k aren’t the Dodgers playing in this game?[/quote]

    The f**cking Cardinals are likely playing since the game is in the stadium of their Triple A affiliate.

    The Dodgers would have been a good choice, though, very appropriate.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 8:35 pm |

    Valley’s uniforms are Russell.
    East’s uniforms are Nike.

    The “S” company in question makes my high school’s girls uniforms but the boys are made by Russell: (do NOT look at the away uniform if offended by purple, you’ve been warned):
    Girls home
    Boys home
    Boys away
    I think the thing I hate even more than the color purple on those uniforms is that the school logo–the I surrounded by a circle and feathers–is on the uniform 4 times! Left and right legs, belt buckle area, and neck. We used to have an Indian head logo until a few years ago when we had to change it but were allowed to keep “Indians” as our mascot.

  • Scott | March 7, 2007 at 8:37 pm |

    WHAT IS UP WITH SEAN TAYLOR IN THIS PICTURE. THE FACEMASK, THE SOCKS, THE BELT, IS HE OBSESSED WITH STRIPING?

  • Scott | March 7, 2007 at 8:38 pm |

    AND DO YOU THINK HE WAS FINED FOR THIS OBSCENE GET-UP?

  • WVU Tom | March 7, 2007 at 8:57 pm |

    WVU looking good in thier home gold unis (my personal favorite–much better than the greys that were featured last year) with vertically arched letting!

  • Smail | March 7, 2007 at 9:16 pm |

    [quote comment=”59034″]Valley’s uniforms are Russell.
    East’s uniforms are Nike.

    The “S” company in question makes my high school’s girls uniforms but the boys are made by Russell: (do NOT look at the away uniform if offended by purple, you’ve been warned):
    Girls home
    Boys home
    Boys away
    I think the thing I hate even more than the color purple on those uniforms is that the school logo–the I surrounded by a circle and feathers–is on the uniform 4 times! Left and right legs, belt buckle area, and neck. We used to have an Indian head logo until a few years ago when we had to change it but were allowed to keep “Indians” as our mascot.[/quote]
    Playing against the J-Hawks in the away picture. I don’t think I’ve ever seen Jayhawk abbreviated that way. Or does it mean something else?

  • Tim | March 7, 2007 at 9:25 pm |

    Nike doesn’t happen to have a new designer on hand? Were the socks foreshadowing?

    Weird.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 9:29 pm |

    You are correct, it stands for Jayhawk. Urbandale Jayhawks. In fact, their mascot is a simplified version of the Kansas Jayhawks.

  • Matt W | March 7, 2007 at 9:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”59038″][quote comment=”59034″]Valley’s uniforms are Russell.
    East’s uniforms are Nike.

    The “S” company in question makes my high school’s girls uniforms but the boys are made by Russell: (do NOT look at the away uniform if offended by purple, you’ve been warned):
    Girls home
    Boys home
    Boys away
    I think the thing I hate even more than the color purple on those uniforms is that the school logo–the I surrounded by a circle and feathers–is on the uniform 4 times! Left and right legs, belt buckle area, and neck. We used to have an Indian head logo until a few years ago when we had to change it but were allowed to keep “Indians” as our mascot.[/quote]
    Playing against the J-Hawks in the away picture. I don’t think I’ve ever seen Jayhawk abbreviated that way. Or does it mean something else?[/quote]

    No, as a former conference rival to both Indianola and Urbandale (I went to Ankeny), J-Hawk is just a stupid abreviation of Jayhawk. They even jacked KU’s mascot, too!

    http://www.j-hawks.c...

  • Smail | March 7, 2007 at 9:36 pm |

    [quote comment=”59040″]You are correct, it stands for Jayhawk. Urbandale Jayhawks. In fact, their mascot is a simplified version of the Kansas Jayhawks.[/quote]

    wow, rock chalk tard-hawk. That is pretty lame. KU needs to go all Wisconsin on them.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 9:46 pm |

    Smail…I’m stealing that line and sharing it with my Urbandale friends who are bragging about beating us in substate finals last night…thanks! I’ve been telling them for a looong time that KU should go Wisconsin on them but they insist that they “look nothing alike”. Umm….yea get your eyes fixed.

    Also in our conference are the Southeast Polk Rams, who I believe look like a beagle with horns.

  • Matt W | March 7, 2007 at 9:55 pm |

    [quote comment=”59043″]Smail…I’m stealing that line and sharing it with my Urbandale friends who are bragging about beating us in substate finals last night…thanks! I’ve been telling them for a looong time that KU should go Wisconsin on them but they insist that they “look nothing alike”. Umm….yea get your eyes fixed.

    Also in our conference are the Southeast Polk Rams, who I believe look like a beagle with horns.[/quote]

    The beagle with horns line is perfect. Although it is a number of years since I’ve left Ankeny, that is a perfect description of SE Polk’s mascot!

  • Travis | March 7, 2007 at 9:57 pm |

    [quote comment=”59033″][quote comment=”59032″]Re: The Civil Rights Game.

    The bigger and much more important question is why the f**k are the Cardinals playing in the game? The Indians I can understand as they had the American Leagues first black player in Larry Doby, but thye f**king Cardinals??!! They had perhaps the single most virulently bigoted and racist player in all of major league baseball at the time in scumsack Enos “Country” Slaughter who was quoted on more then one occasion as saying that “If a nigger ever plays for the Cardinals while I’m here, I’ll kill that nigger myself.”

    Why the f**k aren’t the Dodgers playing in this game?[/quote]

    The f**cking Cardinals are likely playing since the game is in the stadium of their Triple A affiliate.

    The Dodgers would have been a good choice, though, very appropriate.[/quote]

    The fact that it’s being played in the stadium of a Cardinals minor league affiliate is a bullshit excuse.

  • Smail | March 7, 2007 at 9:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”59043″]Smail…I’m stealing that line and sharing it with my Urbandale friends who are bragging about beating us in substate finals last night…thanks! I’ve been telling them for a looong time that KU should go Wisconsin on them but they insist that they “look nothing alike”. Umm….yea get your eyes fixed.

    Also in our conference are the Southeast Polk Rams, who I believe look like a beagle with horns.[/quote]
    Glad to be of help. Hopefully I can close the italics tag too.

  • Deron | March 7, 2007 at 10:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”59034″]Valley’s uniforms are Russell.
    East’s uniforms are Nike.

    The “S” company in question makes my high school’s girls uniforms but the boys are made by Russell: (do NOT look at the away uniform if offended by purple, you’ve been warned):
    Girls home
    Boys home
    Boys away
    I think the thing I hate even more than the color purple on those uniforms is that the school logo–the I surrounded by a circle and feathers–is on the uniform 4 times! Left and right legs, belt buckle area, and neck. We used to have an Indian head logo until a few years ago when we had to change it but were allowed to keep “Indians” as our mascot.[/quote]

    The “S” company is Speedline and they make a lot of different unis for a lot of different sports, mast of which copy another company.

  • =bg= | March 7, 2007 at 10:42 pm |

    More on new Nike NCAAs;
    http://sports.yahoo....

  • Paul Lukas | March 7, 2007 at 11:13 pm |

    [quote comment=”59030″]Didn’t Paul say something another gift card raffle…I think it was a day or two Uni Watch went down…?[/quote]

    I’ve been waiting for the Distant Replays people to provide me with the gift card code number. Can’t do the raffle until they give it to me. They’ve been slow to respond.

  • Allison | March 7, 2007 at 11:42 pm |

    It appears that the Cedar Rapids Jefferson Jayhawks also shorten things to J-Hawks

  • Wayne | March 8, 2007 at 12:51 am |

    GREAT throwbacks tonight for the Nuggets-Warriors game. Both teams should switch their regular unis to these for good.

  • gak | March 8, 2007 at 1:54 am |

    More “cute” Mets uniform news: everyday shortstop Jose Reyes, as you know, wears number 7. Meanwhile, nonroster catcher Jose Reyes wears number 77.

  • James Craven | March 8, 2007 at 3:31 am |

    Once again, Nike makes a lot of uniforms.

    STOP THE INSANITY!

  • JW | March 8, 2007 at 5:44 am |

    [quote comment=”59022″]“but to say that these problems could be fixed through ‘contributions’ from teams or universities or by changing the name of a team from ‘Indians’ or ‘Braves’ to something else I think is a bit simplistic and glib.”

    I find it interesting that schools like Illinois, North & South Dakota, Florida…..all state names based on Native American Indian words, thus the use of indian based mascots, etc. What next, rename the actual State name???? It’s getting out of hand. More excuses for uniform changes, too.[/quote]

    Actually, Florida is named after pascua florida, Spanish for flowery Easter because Ponce de León landed there during that season.

  • S Bennett | March 8, 2007 at 8:43 am |

    Also in our conference are the Southeast Polk Rams, who I believe look like a beagle with horns.[/quote]

    Looks like this in real life.

  • ACC (the Brain) | March 8, 2007 at 2:07 pm |

    [quote comment=”59054″]GREAT throwbacks tonight for the Nuggets-Warriors game. Both teams should switch their regular unis to these for good.[/quote]

    No way. The Warriors play in Oakland. The City refers to San Francisco. Either they move back to SF Cow Palace for their home games or they retire those throwbacks. Their current unis are fine as is – with a few minor flaws.

    Denver’s throwback unis were probably the worst they’ve ever had.

  • o | March 9, 2007 at 11:51 am |

    [quote comment=”58897″]You are right Wade. The “Native Americans” Or “Indians”, are not true American Natives. They came over from Russia across the land bridge that used to connect to Alaska and made their way down here.[/quote]

    Yes! And Europeans aren’t Native Europeans, nor are Asians native to Asia, Australians native to Oceania… since humanity came out of Africa! ;-)

    I know this has been discussed a million times, but I think that the thing that gets to people about Indian mascots is that it promotes a myth of extinction, at least for people on the East Coast from where Indians were first forced westward. At the very least it is a back-handed compliment on the spirit of a people that have suffered so much pain and loss. It’s that feeling of “‘They’ aren’t here anymore, ‘we’ are the victors, so let’s appropriate their culture and names and traditions.” Caricature isn’t bad when you can balance it with reality, but as Chris Rock said, “When was the last time you saw an Indian family eating at the food court in the mall?” (of course more common to folks in OK, AZ, etc.)

    So while we can debate on “Braves”, “Indians” & “Seminoles”, to have a team representing the nation’s capital called the “Redskins” is just in incredibly poor taste in my opinion.

  • Tim B. | April 1, 2007 at 9:46 am |

    [quote comment=”58855″]Someone mentioned in the comments on Sunday that the nameplate on Tom Brady’s jersey might be switched to T. BRADY now that the Pats have signed TE Kyle Brady, but according to this article that isn’t going to happen. (Down at the bottom of the page.)[/quote]

    Does it make sense that players need a first initial to differentiate them from teammates with the same last name? What’s the point of the number? I’m cynically sure it must have something to do with marketing but it’s just plain stupid!

  • Erin | April 1, 2007 at 2:23 pm |

    Wow, those Decorah socks are hot. I honestly thought they were Team USA when I saw them walking around the tournament in their warm ups. M school beat them in the semis, but they looked sharp even while losing.

  • Mae | April 9, 2007 at 1:44 pm |

    You definitely wouldn’t want to re-name the Indians “Spiders.” They were the worst team in baseball history until the Detroit Tigers outdid them a few seasons back.
    The name “Indians” was coined during Sockalexis’ rookie year in 1897. Back then team names changed all the time. When the current AL team took the name Indians in 1915 (Sockalexis died in 1913) they made no mention of him in the announcement and the paper featured horrible racist cartoons. Now the team has had to backpedal and claim they were honoring Sockalexis with the name.

    Like any of us, American Indians are individuals with different points of view. Regarding the mascot
    issue, an Ojibwe friend of mine is very offended
    by the stereotypical tomahawks,war whoops, and imitations of their sacred dances. But another friend who’s Lakota says he couldn’t care less about mascots when his reservation is dealing with 80% unemployment, alcoholism, diabetes, and youth gangs.
    However, they both agree that Chief Wahoo is disgusting!

  • Mae | April 9, 2007 at 1:57 pm |

    p.s Here’s the link if you’re curious to see those cartoons that were typical of that era:
    http://websearch.cs....