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Dirty Work

mud3.jpg

Whatever else you may think of football, it’s got one major advantage over every other American sport: No matter what the weather is, the game goes on. That point was driven home nicely two nights ago, when Bowling Green and Miami of Ohio played in a mild monsoon that turned the field into a quagmire. The result: a classic mudder (now, as always, the best argument against artificial turf).

As it happens, reader Tom Konecny was at the game. Here’s his report:

I’ve attended a lot of sporting events all over the country in my life, and this was pretty bad (the pix don’t do it justice). Punishing winds and horizontal rain. The cheerleaders were wearing those “track suit”-type nylon outfits, and on one of the smaller women it was inflating like a balloon and throwing her around. Thankfully, we had a gigantic golf umbrella and were bundled well.

This got me thinking: What happens if the uni numbers become illegible due to mud, and how do the officials handle the problem? Is there anything in the rulebooks (in any sport) on how to handle this?

Good question. I’m not aware of any such provision. Anyone..?

Speaking of mudders: This sensational book, which features dynamite photos from the late 1950s and illustrations from the NFL’s early days (highly recommended — see link at right), features an entire section devoted to mud, as you can see here, here, and here (also note the amazing facemask at far right).

You probably love mudders too — everybody does (well, maybe except equipment managers, laundry attendants, and groundskeepers). And therein lies a paradox: If we love uniforms, why do we also love seeing them get mucked up? This, dear reader, is a question that each of us will have to answer for him- or herself.

Shop(ping) Assistants Wanted: Webmaster Johnny Ek and I want to set up a Uni Watch-themed Amazon store, which basically means we’re trying to compile a list of items sold by Amazon that would appeal to Uni Watch readers — books, DVDs, sportswear (see obvious example at right), whatever. Amazon sells pretty much everything imaginable these days, so the possibilities are almost limitless.

And who better to know what would appeal to Uni Watch readers than other Uni Watch readers? That’s where you come in: If you’ve got Amazon-available items that you’d like to recommend, please send a note to amazonlist at earthlink dot net (note that this is not the usual Uni Watch address). If possible, please provide Amazon’s URLs for the items in question — or, better yet, just give me the items’ ASINs or ISBNs, which are listed in the “Product Details” section of every Amazon listing.

Ideally, we’ll end up with a wide-ranging inventory of cool stuff, all of it recommended either by me or by you — just in time for holiday shopping. And yes, Nike products are fine. But I reserve the right not to list anything purple.

Uni Watch News Ticker: Bit of a retired number controversy at Marquette (with thanks to Adam Kirby). … More collar news, courtesy of Antti Salmi (who reads Uni Watch in Finland!): “Many European hockey teams used to have pointed collars. Currently in Finnish league, only TPS Turku and Karpat Oulu have them. In the old days, jerseys were made by Finnish companies Koho and Tackla. I can’t say much about other European leagues, because obtaining photo reference is quite time-consuming [Tell me about it. — PL]. In Finnish rules baseball — or Pespallo, as we call it in Finnish, pointed collars are standard.” … Not sure how we’ve managed not to discuss this all week long, but Fresno State, whose helmets normally look like this, went with blank helmets for last Saturday’s game against New Mexico State. Full details here (with thanks to Kent Meckling). … Good article here about the NBA’s new uni guidelines, and the players’ reaction to them. … Amusing blog entry here about why the A’s logo has an apostrophe (with thanks to RJ Charles). … Wondering how Ohio State awards its merit decals? Look here, here, here, and here. (With thanks to OSU mega-fan Chad Klenk.) … Let’s all root for this guy. … In case you’ve missed it in the Comments section, there’s been some discussion of the bottom of DeAngelo Williams’s shoes, which are very shiny. For an explanation, look here. … Frank Mercogliano notes that Maine hoops players wear an America East logo patch on their rear jerseys — except for the team’s freshmen, whose jerseys are patch-free. … Excellent page tracking the evolution of the Iowa State logo, all the way back to the 1800s, here (recommended by Josh Yetmar). … Neil Shaffer notes that MLB.com recently included the following uni-related tidbit: ” ‘[MLB’s vice president of on-field operations] Bob Watson gave the on-field operations report. He talked about the pace of the game, and we went through some of the uniform guidelines,’ said Joe Garagiola Jr., MLB’s senior vice president of baseball operations. ‘[The changes are] pretty small: additional language on baggy shirts and pants was added so that there can now be a determination as to whether it is giving a player a competitive advantage, in addition to making it more difficult for an umpire to make a call.'” … Even if you don’t agree with the use of “major” in this news bulletin, it’s still bad news. … Good range of old uniforms shown in this gallery of Harvard/Yale programs (with apologies to the person who sent me the link — I appear to have misplaced your name). … Tom Konecny has nominated Uni Watch for the Weblog Awards. Further details when the voting begins next month.

 

186 comments to Dirty Work

  • John | November 17, 2006 at 8:59 am |

    Speaking of Fresno State. What is the green V that they always have on their helmets? What is the meaning??

  • Paul P | November 17, 2006 at 8:59 am |

    Looks like Belichick will consider using a suit after all. That will be interesting!

  • Vern | November 17, 2006 at 9:00 am |

    What in the world is #11 wearing on his arm?

  • Nick | November 17, 2006 at 9:04 am |

    That’s just an Adidas sweat band with most of the material cut out so it leaves only elastic and a little of the material. He then cut around the Adidas logo.

  • Joe O | November 17, 2006 at 9:09 am |

    [quote comment=”23314″]Looks like Belichick will consider using a suit after all. That will be interesting!

    [/quote]
    Will he cut the sleeves off of the suit too?

  • Vern | November 17, 2006 at 9:20 am |

    [quote comment=”23316″]That’s just an Adidas sweat band with most of the material cut out so it leaves only elastic and a little of the material. He then cut around the Adidas logo.[/quote]

    Is there a point to it?

  • Rich | November 17, 2006 at 9:26 am |

    [quote comment=”23313″]Speaking of Fresno State. What is the green V that they always have on their helmets? What is the meaning??[/quote]

    Check the FAQs here…

  • The Original Lee | November 17, 2006 at 9:27 am |

    while i think that advertising on the front of jerseys in many sports is bad, for soccer, i really dont have a problem with it, if its done correctly. if it stays somewhat within the teams color scheme it be good.
    example- Inter Milan
    http://info.wohoo.co...

    notice how Pirelli changes the color of their logo to match the color scheme, whether home or away.

    however, some can really make the jerseys look like shit.

    http://www.psv.nl/up...

    but great socks.
    unfortunately i think the latter is what will be seen in the MLS.

  • Robert | November 17, 2006 at 9:27 am |

    [quote comment=”23316″]That’s just an Adidas sweat band with most of the material cut out so it leaves only elastic and a little of the material. He then cut around the Adidas logo.[/quote]

    Those little thin strips that I see football players wear above their elbows are sweatbands? I always wondered about that. I had figured they were some sort of ornamental fad.

  • Andrew F | November 17, 2006 at 9:31 am |

    Hate to break it, but this was Spencer Hawe’s look in HS. I don’t think he’ll really be wearing that getup for Washington this year.

    This company makes a lot of the European hockey jerseys (as well as my college team’s) and has an option for the full collar. The guys on my team wanted the collar so they could ‘pop’ it. I told them that I would ‘pop’ them in the cup if they did. Needless to say, we don’t have the collars (executive decision on my part). I did however have to compromise and make a black jerseys (although the other one is a yellow Sweden lookalike! Beaut…)

  • Bruce Johnson | November 17, 2006 at 9:39 am |

    Aside from the obvious issue with advertising on jerseys, I think it is a terrible decision for the MLS from a business perspective. The MLS is struggling to bring its product into the mainstream and get more “Casual” sports fans. I don’t see how making the jerseys different from the cultural norm will help with those tasks. If anything, it will give anti-soccer fans another reason to mock the sport.

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 9:40 am |

    I had a longer post, but the security code gremlin ate it, so here’s the abbreviated version….

    MLS should proceed with shirt sponsorship because (1) it needs the money, and (2) there is minimal risk of alienating an emotionally committed fanbase.

    1) MLS isn’t exactly swimming in cash right now and the primary method of raising money for sports leagues around here (sell the right to TV, which in turn sell advertising) is a non-starter because there are no in-game commercial breaks.

    2) Even the oldest teams were created out of thin air 11 years ago in what was a commercial enterprise from minute one. At the outset individual owners even possessed multiple franchises — I mean “clubs.” And almost everyone knows this. The few soccer fans out there that love their team with all their being and cannot remember a time without their cherished DC United or Houston Dynamo (or is it Houston 1836? Or is it the SJ Earthquakes?) aren’t even old enough to drive yet. I think they’ll make it through this crisis.

  • JohnBoy | November 17, 2006 at 9:41 am |

    Paul,
    What will you do when Spencer Hawes (the UW baksetball player) goes on the road and wears this?

    (Sorry, Spencer hasn’t played a road game yet, so you get our newest NBA star, Brandon Roy)

  • Burrill | November 17, 2006 at 9:43 am |

    I don’t know the NFL rules on this, but I know high school and college football are required to stop the game for one sort of bad weather: lightning. Having endured a number of delayed or postponed high school games, I knew high schools were careful about that, but I got the message at the college level when I was at the Michigan/Central Michigan football game that was delayed for an hour due to a lightning storm.

    So yes, football will play in the ugliest weather (which is something I love about it), but not in lightning.

    Actually, my local high school’s first-round playoff game this year was played in some ugly weather. It had been a wet week, and it had rained most of that day, so the field — already a bit beat up — took a beating that night.

    We had to play two more playoff games on that field, too. Surprisingly, even though it hasn’t been in very good shape for a few years (they built a new high school in a nearby low area, and it ruined the field’s drainage), it held up relatively well for the following games. But — cover your eyes, Paul — they are planning to install turf before next season. I will miss the grass, even though they’ve had some trouble with it the last few years.

  • Nick Maibroda | November 17, 2006 at 9:43 am |

    This article explains why some of us enjoy muddy, dirty football. It is from a Canadian source, but the man did play in the NFL with the Cowboys no less.

  • Riley | November 17, 2006 at 9:49 am |

    [quote comment=”23328″]I don’t know the NFL rules on this, but I know high school and college football are required to stop the game for one sort of bad weather: lightning. Having endured a number of delayed or postponed high school games, I knew high schools were careful about that, but I got the message at the college level when I was at the Michigan/Central Michigan football game that was delayed for an hour due to a lightning storm.

    So yes, football will play in the ugliest weather (which is something I love about it), but not in lightning.

    Actually, my local high school’s first-round playoff game this year was played in some ugly weather. It had been a wet week, and it had rained most of that day, so the field — already a bit beat up — took a beating that night.

    We had to play two more playoff games on that field, too. Surprisingly, even though it hasn’t been in very good shape for a few years (they built a new high school in a nearby low area, and it ruined the field’s drainage), it held up relatively well for the following games. But — cover your eyes, Paul — they are planning to install turf before next season. I will miss the grass, even though they’ve had some trouble with it the last few years.[/quote]

    I know the CFL delays games for lightning (I’ve been at a couple) and I would have to assume that it is the same in the NFL.

  • Pat | November 17, 2006 at 9:57 am |

    [quote comment=”23322″][quote comment=”23316″]That’s just an Adidas sweat band with most of the material cut out so it leaves only elastic and a little of the material. He then cut around the Adidas logo.[/quote]

    Those little thin strips that I see football players wear above their elbows are sweatbands? I always wondered about that. I had figured they were some sort of ornamental fad.[/quote]

    They are just an ornamental fad. Wide recievers and sometimes defensive backs do it a lot to make their arms look bigger. It frames the bicep.

  • Schafe | November 17, 2006 at 10:01 am |

    Logo creep alert. In the WVU-Pitt game last night in the second quarter Darrelle Revis had a 73-yard punt return for a touchdown, getting a crushing block from Derek Kinder that took out two WVU tacklers to spring him. Well, Kinder was wearing one of the Nike “smiley face” mismatched sleeves despite Pitt being an Adidas team. Sorry no screen grab.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 10:10 am |

    [quote comment=”23334″]Logo creep alert. In the WVU-Pitt game last night in the second quarter Darrelle Revis had a 73-yard punt return for a touchdown, getting a crushing block from Derek Kinder that took out two WVU tacklers to spring him. Well, Kinder was wearing one of the Nike “smiley face” mismatched sleeves despite Pitt being an Adidas team. Sorry no screen grab.[/quote]

    Yeah, he actually had the swoosh exposed for most of the game, but toward the end, somebody put some athletic tape on it to cover it up.

  • BtotheE | November 17, 2006 at 10:10 am |

    That feild took a beating, but turf does not have to be the answer. Drainage systems have improved much in the last ten years and can ease many of the problems with fields being detroyed. But I have to say that I love a good mud bowl. Turf (what ever kind) should be a last consideration. here. Pricey here, but I am sure there are cheaper alternatives for smaller colleges and highschool. I also can’t make the argument that the grass could save money in the long run over turf (with injuries with the every Nole going down this year) but this shows that feilds can help ease the burrden of the weather.

  • Joe Hilseberg | November 17, 2006 at 10:15 am |

    Paul…got the tattoos in the mail yesterday…SWEET!!!

  • grb | November 17, 2006 at 10:20 am |

    I heard that the Dodgers will be introducing a road cap for the 2007 season. Any idea what it will look like?

  • Trevor Worley | November 17, 2006 at 10:22 am |

    Paul,
    Thanks again for coming onto the show, next time I’d like to have you on for 30 minutes, there were a lot of topics I would have like to have gotten to. Thanks again!

    Trevor Worley
    KADI 1340 Morning Drive Sports Report

  • specs | November 17, 2006 at 10:23 am |

    I agree with the points made in posts 8, 10, and 11 regarding sponsorship on soccer jerseys. In addition, I think it is more important for MLS to emulate the best soccer leagues and teams in the world (which all have sponsors on the front of their jerseys) than it is for them to emulate the NFL, NBA, or MLB. Also, MLS teams have had sponsors somewhere on their jerseys in the past, and in my opinion, having something on the front that looks like it is supposed to be there (like Pirelli on Inter’s jerseys) looks significantly better than something on the lower back that looks like an afterthought.

  • Burrill | November 17, 2006 at 10:25 am |

    [quote comment=”23337″]That feild took a beating, but turf does not have to be the answer. Drainage systems have improved much in the last ten years and can ease many of the problems with fields being detroyed. But I have to say that I love a good mud bowl. Turf (what ever kind) should be a last consideration. here.

    Pricey here, but I am sure there are cheaper alternatives for smaller colleges and highschool. I also can’t make the argument that the grass could save money in the long run over turf (with injuries with the every Nole going down this year) but this shows that feilds can help ease the burrden of the weather.[/quote]

    Unfortunately, in the high school world, there’s another consideration: multipurpose fields. The field here will be purchased with private funds, and one of the big advantages they’re pushing is the ability to use the field practically every day for a variety of things. Even with a good grass field, there’s only so much you use it before it shows the wear, and a lot of high schools prefer to be able to use their facilities for as much as possible. But for colleges that do not have that consideration, grass is an easy choice.

    There has been one notable exception when it comes to grass: Michigan. They tried a number of different types of grass and drainage systems, and they could not get a grass field to stick.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 10:26 am |

    Some sweet euroleague jerseys

  • Andy | November 17, 2006 at 10:28 am |

    I don’t know if this has been brought up yet, but looking at the latest ESPN article I was offended by the new Texas Tech uniforms . Is that a different color red on the side trim stripes than on the numbers and other trim? Is it just me or does that look like crap?

  • Andrew F | November 17, 2006 at 10:30 am |

    There was a Hofstra- Stony Brook I-AA game last year that had a few long lightning delays. It was an Astroturf Field, so the mud wasn’t a problem, but they decided to shorten the second half by 10 minutes (5 min per quarter) since Hofstra was already crushing them. Details here http://www.hofstra.e...

  • Broker75 | November 17, 2006 at 10:31 am |

    [quote comment=”23344″]I don’t know if this has been brought up yet, but looking at the latest ESPN article I was offended by the new Texas Tech uniforms . Is that a different color red on the side trim stripes than on the numbers and other trim? Is it just me or does that look like crap?[/quote]
    I think it’s just you.

  • Teebz | November 17, 2006 at 10:34 am |

    This has nothing to do with the topic, but…

    Minna, I’m not sure what site you saw yesterday, but I can assure you mine does not appear on Google. It’s a small but faithful readership, not even close to what Paul gets here. :o)

  • Daniel | November 17, 2006 at 10:34 am |

    I remember watching some of the Bowling Green-Miami game, and Miami’s quarterback’s back was completely covered by mud at one point. The front was okay, so I guess they didn’t have to change anything. Who won that game, anyway?

  • Nick | November 17, 2006 at 10:35 am |

    On behalf of all Salt Lakers and Utahns, I apologize that Real Salt Lake is breaking the ad-free trend on uniforms. They never got my business before and they definitely will not now.

  • Pat | November 17, 2006 at 10:35 am |

    I wish the Harvard Yale programs hadn’t started using photos in 1961. The artwork on the older programs was great.

    I especially like this one. I am not sure if Norman Rockwell actually did the work on it (no credit that I can find) but there were a few that gave me that impression. Such as this and this (which is clearly a Rockwell production).

    The ones that have photos of players on them give me the feeling of a nice friendly rivalry. I know it’s not a heated rivalry like some others but therer is some history. Check out these players getting friendly with eachother (seem to be enjoying a nice picnic. How about these guys hanging out on the street corner. Huh?

    Anyway, I think that they should go back to the illustrated covers. They had some life in them and you could clearly tell when Yale was trying to stick it to Harvard on the cover of their home game programs. And sometimes Harvard would take the same route, sticking it to Yale (notice the bulldog in the crimson colored dog house).

    This one is my favorite.

  • Dwight | November 17, 2006 at 10:38 am |

    Iowa State should ditch the current cyclone turning into a bird and bring back the Cy logo from 1978. Cool looking and this is from a U of Iowa fan.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 10:38 am |

    [quote comment=”23344″]I don’t know if this has been brought up yet, but looking at the latest ESPN article I was offended by the new Texas Tech uniforms. Is that a different color red on the side trim stripes than on the numbers and other trim?[/quote]

    I’m pretty sure that adidas was more concerned about getting some variation of three stripes on the jersey and shorts than about if the uniforms “matched colors” or “looked decent”.

  • The Ol Goaler | November 17, 2006 at 10:42 am |

    Concerning “mudders”… Usually, the uni numbers remain visible no matter how muddy the jersey gets… because most uni numbers in football are NOT made out of cloth! (They’re one version or another of the kind of stuff you “iron on” to a T-shirt.)

    Also, receivers, QBs, and most running backs tend to get a lot less muddy than the linemen. Since the only reason football officials care about a player’s number is to make sure there are five “ineligible receiver” numbers (50-79) on the offensive line, it’s not a problem.

  • JJD | November 17, 2006 at 10:43 am |

    [quote comment=”23324″]Hate to break it, but this was Spencer Hawe’s look in HS.[/quote]

    How did Spencer Hawes come up? Anyway, that’s not his HS uniform, that’s one from a camp. Here’s his home Seattle Prep uni, and here’s his road uni (on the left. Kind of close to Kansas’.

    And I don’t care WHAT Paul says, the Huskies’ basketball unis are sweet.

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 10:43 am |

    I know that Michigan State got new uniforms for this season but I’m not sure if anyone else has noticed that they have a white stripe on the rear of their shorts of their away jerseys, and that on their home whites you can see the line of the stitching but they don’t have a green stipe. I didn’t know that they had stripes on their backs?!?!

  • Ed | November 17, 2006 at 10:45 am |

    Speaking of Real Salt Lake (and getting off topic a bit)…what the heck?!?

    OK, many MLS teams use original names, while others use names that are rips of other famous soccer clubs (Galaxy, Dynamo, etc.) The latter may be unoriginal, but what the heck, MLS needs all the help with name recognition it can get.

    Then we get to the team names that are more European in style. For example, FC Dallas – obvious rip of FC Barcelona – but “Football Club Dallas” at least makes sense absent the original context.

    DC United – obviously a rip on Man U, but since DC is the location of the capital of the UNITED States…OK.

    Red Bull New York & Chivas USA – crass commercialism, yes. Bizarre context, no.

    But Real Salt Lake? A rip of Real Madrid Club de Futbol (“Royal Madrid Football Club”)? What’s so royal about Salt Lake City? Absolutely absurd in context.

    (OK, not normal Uni Watch stuff, but if we care about abuse of tradition in uniforms, what about abuse the club name’s context?)

    ed

  • Jim H | November 17, 2006 at 10:50 am |

    [quote comment=”23349″]I remember watching some of the Bowling Green-Miami game, and Miami’s quarterback’s back was completely covered by mud at one point. The front was okay, so I guess they didn’t have to change anything. Who won that game, anyway?[/quote]

    Miami of Ohio won when the kicker for Bowling Green fell down trying to kick the game winning field goal

  • Andy#11 | November 17, 2006 at 10:52 am |

    [quote comment=”23353″][quote comment=”23344″]I don’t know if this has been brought up yet, but looking at the latest ESPN article I was offended by the new Texas Tech uniforms. Is that a different color red on the side trim stripes than on the numbers and other trim?[/quote]

    I’m pretty sure that adidas was more concerned about getting some variation of three stripes on the jersey and shorts than about if the uniforms “matched colors” or “looked decent”.[/quote]

    I think those side stripes look very out of place on the uniforms.

    vertical stripes down the side of a uni = good (usually)
    horizontal stripes down the side = odd (usually)

    I don’t think those stripes resemble the Adidas stripes in any way.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 11:04 am |

    Some perspective from someone who draws an occasional paycheck from an MLS club:

    [quote comment=”23350″]On behalf of all Salt Lakers and Utahns, I apologize that Real Salt Lake is breaking the ad-free trend on uniforms. They never got my business before and they definitely will not now.[/quote]

    Since we never had ya, we won’t miss ya.

    [quote comment=”23357″]Speaking of Real Salt Lake (and getting off topic a bit)…what the heck?!?

    OK, many MLS teams use original names, while others use names that are rips of other famous soccer clubs (Galaxy, Dynamo, etc.) The latter may be unoriginal, but what the heck, MLS needs all the help with name recognition it can get.

    Then we get to the team names that are more European in style. For example, FC Dallas – obvious rip of FC Barcelona – but “Football Club Dallas” at least makes sense absent the original context.

    DC United – obviously a rip on Man U, but since DC is the location of the capital of the UNITED States…OK.

    Red Bull New York & Chivas USA – crass commercialism, yes. Bizarre context, no.

    But Real Salt Lake? A rip of Real Madrid Club de Futbol (“Royal Madrid Football Club”)? What’s so royal about Salt Lake City? Absolutely absurd in context.[/quote]

    1 – We’re with you on Real Salt Lake. It makes no sense. It was a stupid name two years ago, it’s still stupid. It has no context or connection to anything Utahn. But the owner wanted to do it, so he did it. Case closed.

    2 – Exactly which “famous soccer club” is called the “Galaxy” that LA’s team is emulating?

    3 – As for FC Dallas being an “obvious rip on FC Barcelona” – WTF? As if Barca is the only “FC” in the world?

    4 – Ditto for DC United being an “obvious rip on ManU.” What are you smoking? Manchester United may be the best-known “United” in the world, but it’s far from the only. United is the single most traditional soccer team name there is, and DC’s braintrust has always wanted to do things in the most traditional way possible. As for the canard of “capital of the United States” that always seems to get brought up, it’s just that – a canard. It’s a traditional name for a traditional club and doesn’t have anything to do with it playing in the capital of the United States.

    5 – I’m with you on the other stuff. It is what it is, though.

    [quote comment=”23325″]Aside from the obvious issue with advertising on jerseys, I think it is a terrible decision for the MLS from a business perspective. The MLS is struggling to bring its product into the mainstream and get more “Casual” sports fans. I don’t see how making the jerseys different from the cultural norm will help with those tasks. If anything, it will give anti-soccer fans another reason to mock the sport.[/quote]

    1 – Actually, it’s a great decision from a business perspective. A million a year for a team that probably doesn’t have a $7 million annual budget is a big deal. It’s financial reality. Deal.

    2 – “Casual sports fans” have not ever, do not now, and are unlikely to ever embrace MLS, so we’re going to do what we need to do and, basically, to hell with them. We’re trying to get the people who are standing right outside the tent to come in first. Those down the street aren’t coming to begin with.

    3 – Advertising on the front of jerseys isn’t different from the “cultural norm” – the soccer cultural norm. That’s different from your American football culture, your basketball culture, your cricket culture, your hockey culture, and any other culture. I’ve seen the soccer culture. I was one of the thousands of Americans who spent their own dough to go to Germany for the World Cup, yet I was one of the few there who cares about MLS. The people who are soccer fans, who we’re really trying to get (and not the ever-elusive “casual sports fans”) aren’t going to be fazed by this at all.

    4 – As for “anti-soccer fans” needing another reason to ridicule the sport – bollocks. For eons, they’ve ranted about how soccer is boring and low-scoring and a wussy sport and foreign and yadda yadda yadda. they’re not going to stop, but we’ve long since stopped listening to them. We’re here to stay.

  • specs | November 17, 2006 at 11:14 am |

    Amen, KT. Amen.

  • specs | November 17, 2006 at 11:17 am |

    Also, this doesn’t validate Real Salt Lake’s name, but in addition to Real Madrid, there are four other Spanish Primera teams that have Real in their common name. And if I’m not mistaken, there are a few others that have Real in their formal name. So Real Madrid isn’t as unique as you might think.

  • Cliff Rancho | November 17, 2006 at 11:22 am |

    great post KT. I had to roll my eyes to Nick’s comment.
    As far as sponsorship on jersey arguement goes; I don’t think anybody is going to rule out going to a soccer game because a club has Sony on their jersey. Just like nobody rules out going to a baseball game because the stadium is called “AT&T Park” or “Citizens Bank Park”…except for maybe Nick. It sucks, but advertising keeps popping up, because nobody cares THAT much.

  • Taylor | November 17, 2006 at 11:23 am |

    I know we give Nike a hard time and all with the college bball jerseys (OSU, Fla., Kent., etc.) and we generally don’t give adidas a hard time, but I must say in my opinion the jerseys adidas has designed are awful. I mean, look at Louisville, Wisconsin and Memphis. Adidas is bad, the only jerseys they haven’t messed up is Indiana and UCLA, and they didn’t even design those jerseys! Am I wrong? Or is it just me?

  • V8Cougar | November 17, 2006 at 11:24 am |

    [quote comment=”23365″]Also, this doesn’t validate Real Salt Lake’s name, but in addition to Real Madrid, there are four other Spanish Primera teams that have Real in their common name. And if I’m not mistaken, there are a few others that have Real in their formal name. So Real Madrid isn’t as unique as you might think.[/quote]

    I think the problem lies in real being a Spanish word.

  • Dan | November 17, 2006 at 11:28 am |

    [quote comment=”23357″]Speaking of Real Salt Lake (and getting off topic a bit)…what the heck?!?

    OK, many MLS teams use original names, while others use names that are rips of other famous soccer clubs (Galaxy, Dynamo, etc.) The latter may be unoriginal, but what the heck, MLS needs all the help with name recognition it can get.

    Then we get to the team names that are more European in style. For example, FC Dallas – obvious rip of FC Barcelona – but “Football Club Dallas” at least makes sense absent the original context.

    DC United – obviously a rip on Man U, but since DC is the location of the capital of the UNITED States…OK.

    Red Bull New York & Chivas USA – crass commercialism, yes. Bizarre context, no.

    But Real Salt Lake? A rip of Real Madrid Club de Futbol (“Royal Madrid Football Club”)? What’s so royal about Salt Lake City? Absolutely absurd in context.

    (OK, not normal Uni Watch stuff, but if we care about abuse of tradition in uniforms, what about abuse the club name’s context?)

    ed[/quote]

    These naming practices are common place all over the world, FC Barcelona is not the only FC, its just a commonly used prefix. United is also a very common name although it is slightly varied from language to language. I dont really see them as a rip off in the least. Just common soccer practice

  • Patrick O'Donnell | November 17, 2006 at 11:32 am |

    KT, that was an awesome post. I couldn’t agree with you more. I’ve always thought that the league should try to adhere to the soccer norms, not American norms. It legitimizes the league for fans of European soccer in the US. Those are the fans that MLS needs, because the casual sports fan is a lost cause for any up and coming sport. Props.

    Also, great call on the United and FC thing. That guy got owned.

  • Mark in Shiga | November 17, 2006 at 11:32 am |

    KT, just because other, more widely-known soccer teams put ugly advertising on their jerseys doesn’t mean that MLS has to. Claiming that the money is a big boost is fine; I don’t doubt that for a minute. But jerseys with ads on them are aesthetic duds and I sincerely hope that when MLS becomes more profitable the ads will be reconsidered.

    Will the jerseys sold to fans become a bit cheaper now that we have to advertise some product whenever we wear the shirt? I want compensation for that!

  • Dan | November 17, 2006 at 11:36 am |

    In German, United = Eintracht

    So there is a united in the 2nd league

    TSV Eintracht Braunschweig

    and in the first league

    Eintracht Frankfurt

    Germany has some very interesting pre-fixes to their names…

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 11:40 am |

    [quote comment=”23372″]KT, just because other, more widely-known soccer teams put ugly advertising on their jerseys doesn’t mean that MLS has to. Claiming that the money is a big boost is fine; I don’t doubt that for a minute. But jerseys with ads on them are aesthetic duds and I sincerely hope that when MLS becomes more profitable the ads will be reconsidered.

    Will the jerseys sold to fans become a bit cheaper now that we have to advertise some product whenever we wear the shirt? I want compensation for that![/quote]

    Well, Mark, that is a good point. Being a walking billboard should probably have some recompense.

    As for “ugly advertising,” well, that’s in the eye of the beholder, I guess. Not all teams that have a sponsor name on the front of the jersey do it in a garish or outrageous manner. Real Salt Lake’s shirt doesn’t look ugly at all.

    Trust me, MLS fans have been as worked up about how the aesthetics will work as you and others are. There are some traditional “looks” in MLS (like this one) that fans don’t want to see taken over by advertising.

    Hopefully teams will find a way to do it like RSL is doing it (and like most major teams in the world do it).

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 11:46 am |

    WRT Real and United, yes they’re common names, but does anyone actually doubt that the team owners were trying to piggyback on the success of recognizable teams when creating their own brand?

    Furthermore, colloquially other premiership squads with United in the name (Newcastle, Sheffield, West Ham) typically have the modifier dropped. The exception of course is Manchester which must be distinguished from local rival Man City.

    And I’ll bet dollars to donuts that the owner of Salt Lake wasn’t thinking to himself, “I really dig those plucky lads in Zaragoza. We should try to emulate them whenever possible,” when he settled on ‘Real Salt Lake.’ Also note that RSL has a multiyear partnership deal with Franco’s team. The ‘Real’ moniker is clearly a nod to the Madridistas.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 11:47 am |

    [quote comment=”23374″]are. There are some traditional “looks” in MLS (like this one) that fans don’t want to see taken over by advertising.

    [/quote]

    The best part of this kit (trying to use the correct lingo here!) is unequivocally the fireman’s shield on the (player’s) left chest!

  • Kevin | November 17, 2006 at 11:48 am |

    I know nothing about soccer other than casually hearing about it & occasionally checking out a World Cup game, but that was a good post KT.

    I guess for traditional reasons they called it FC Dallas rather than SC (Soccer Club) Dallas. After all, in the USA FC Dallas could be construed as these guys.

    A million a year is hard to turn down, no matter what the budget, I have a feeling.

  • Bruce Johnson | November 17, 2006 at 11:48 am |

    You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms. Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    Leaving all of that aside, the simple truth is that uniforms with advertisements look ridiculous and completely take away form the brand identity of the team/club.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 11:54 am |

    [quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    [/quote]

    I’m gonna go with the fact that most European leagues don’t have multi-million dollar television contracts and need to sell advertising space whever they can find an inch just to make ends meet . . .(Sort of like what the Red Sox are going to have to do to pay the $51.1 million for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka (good thing I’m not a bitter Yankees Fan, but c’mon . . .$51.1 MILLION . .that’s way too steep)

  • Pat | November 17, 2006 at 11:54 am |

    [quote comment=”23372″]KT, just because other, more widely-known soccer teams put ugly advertising on their jerseys doesn’t mean that MLS has to. Claiming that the money is a big boost is fine; I don’t doubt that for a minute. But jerseys with ads on them are aesthetic duds and I sincerely hope that when MLS becomes more profitable the ads will be reconsidered.

    Will the jerseys sold to fans become a bit cheaper now that we have to advertise some product whenever we wear the shirt? I want compensation for that![/quote]

    Well, if you want to get technical about it. Other than being a way to show that you like a particular player or team, buying a jersey is just a way of selling the team to other people. A basketball team, football team, baseball team, whoever is a product that they are the company (or ownership group) is trying to sell. Plus, when you buy any jersey the logo of the manufacturer is always on the it somewhere, so you are advertising to them too.

    As for the aesthetic value, that’s all to be determined. I’ve seen very classy looking uniforms with advertisements on them. Premeir League soccer and A few rugby teams I have seen here and there have very nice looking aesthetically pleasing jersey’s with advertisements on them. However, the blocked logo (wordmark with a colored block behind them) are very unattractive.

  • Andy#11 | November 17, 2006 at 11:55 am |

    [quote comment=”23372″]…jerseys with ads on them are aesthetic duds and I sincerely hope that when MLS becomes more profitable the ads will be reconsidered…
    [/quote]

    Wait…which one is the aesthetic dud?
    No ad
    vs.
    Ad

  • Pat | November 17, 2006 at 11:58 am |

    [quote comment=”23381″][quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    [/quote]

    I’m gonna go with the fact that most European leagues don’t have multi-million dollar television contracts and need to sell advertising space whever they can find an inch just to make ends meet . . .(Sort of like what the Red Sox are going to have to do to pay the $51.1 million for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka (good thing I’m not a bitter Yankees Fan, but c’mon . . .$51.1 MILLION . .that’s way too steep)[/quote]

    Oh, I know, very steep right. Kind of like the money you are paying Carl Pavano? Is he still alive. You know the Sox will make that back in merch sales, television rights, japanese advertising, tourists, and a few other ways.

  • Frank Mercogliano | November 17, 2006 at 11:58 am |

    Back to an orignal question, but the “V” stands for the Valley…Fresno State was trying to broaden their appeal. Weber State now does a similar thing with their Rail spike/Mountain Logo that they have on the backs of their helmets to regionalize their team a little more.

    As for muddy games and what it would do for the numbers, The Ol Goaler is correct in that for the officials, they just need to know that someone numbered 50-79 doesn’t go beyond the line of scrimmage for a pass. As for the statisticians, it’s very hard…we play in a Dome, but we played a mud game two weeks ago, and I basically helped out with our teams numbers because I knew them better than the stat keepers did.

    In the famous Fog Bowl between Chicago and Philadelphia, interns were on the sidelines with walkie-talkies telling the press box and statisticians what happened.

    Frank

  • Bruce Johnson | November 17, 2006 at 11:59 am |

    [quote comment=”23381″][quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    [/quote]

    I’m gonna go with the fact that most European leagues don’t have multi-million dollar television contracts and need to sell advertising space whever they can find an inch just to make ends meet . . .(Sort of like what the Red Sox are going to have to do to pay the $51.1 million for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka (good thing I’m not a bitter Yankees Fan, but c’mon . . .$51.1 MILLION . .that’s way too steep)[/quote]

    51.1 Million is insane. However, part of the justification was that the money would be recouped in merchandise sales, such as an Matsuzaka jerseys (unfettered by advertising)

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 12:02 pm |

    Leaving all of that aside, the simple truth is that uniforms with advertisements look ridiculous and completely take away form the brand identity of the team/club.

    I strongly disagree. You could take the traditional gear for any number of teams (FCB, Arsenal, Ajax, Inter & AC Milan, Juventus, River Plate, etc.) stamp them each with the same generic ACME logo in the color of your choosing and a knowledgeable fan would still be able to properly identify the squad.

    Sure there’ll be the odd fan who says, “Boca ruled when they were rockin’ the Quilmes, but they totally sold out when they switched to Pepsi.” But they’ll still know the brand identity of the blue and yellow jersey.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 12:04 pm |

    [quote comment=”23385″]

    Oh, I know, very steep right. Kind of like the money you are paying Carl Pavano? Is he still alive. You know the Sox will make that back in merch sales, television rights, japanese advertising, tourists, and a few other ways.[/quote]

    Not trying to start a pissing contest here . . .I just think 51.1 is a lot just to negotiate with the guy. It’s gonna cost another 30-40 to sign him. That’s an AWFUL lot of t-shirts, though. And the Sox have already issued a moratorium on ticket price increases on all seats except the premium seats.
    Looks like it might time to bring back the Hood Bottles on the right-field light stantions, the Monster(.com) Seats, etc. . .
    And the price of a Fenway Frank might go up to $7 (or is it already there?)

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 12:07 pm |

    Minna,

    Good news!!

  • Bruce Johnson | November 17, 2006 at 12:10 pm |

    [quote comment=”23389″]Leaving all of that aside, the simple truth is that uniforms with advertisements look ridiculous and completely take away form the brand identity of the team/club.

    I strongly disagree. You could take the traditional gear for any number of teams (FCB, Arsenal, Ajax, Inter & AC Milan, Juventus, River Plate, etc.) stamp them each with the same generic ACME logo in the color of your choosing and a knowledgeable fan would still be able to properly identify the squad.

    Sure there’ll be the odd fan who says, “Boca ruled when they were rockin’ the Quilmes, but they totally sold out when they switched to Pepsi.” But they’ll still know the brand identity of the blue and yellow jersey.[/quote]

    Fair point. However, in the case of Juventas, there could be some confusion. A number of teams use that color/design template (Notts forest & New Castle come to mind. Actually, and rather depressingly, the best way to tell those apart would be the advert on the jersey.

  • Joe O | November 17, 2006 at 12:12 pm |

    Completely unrelated to the current conversations…but anyone notice that on Wikipedia’s Page 2 page it links his name to this Paul Lukas

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 12:16 pm |

    [quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    Leaving all of that aside, the simple truth is that uniforms with advertisements look ridiculous and completely take away form the brand identity of the team/club.[/quote]

    But you have a problem when dealing with a Soccer (futbol, voetbal, calcio, or whatever language) culture because there is a soccer culture just like there is a basketball, baseball, hockey, or anyother sport. We expect uniforms to look a certain way and that doesn’t mean that changes from that are bad but the differences can still fit into the regular category.

    The reason why Americans think that advertising on uniforms look dumb in basketball, baseball, and hockey is because of how successful these sports have been in America. Soccer is trying to get into becoming a mainstream sport in America and advertising is definitely part of it. Soccer is more of a world sport other than baseball and basketball and football but hockey is bigger worldwide than the others, so selling ads on jerseys for the MLS is not a problem as it fits with the top teams and leagues in the world. In hockey the top league is the NHL even though it is not a US founded sport but the NHL has existed in the US since 1924 so we as Americans are used to the look of the NHL and wouldn’t accept logos on uniforms in the NHL. But, for European leagues of basketball and football it’s a different thing entirely. The best players leave for the US and advertising is a must for those leagues to turn a profit and we all know that that is what this business is all about.

    So, after the lengthy post (sorry), the MLS should be commended for adding revunue to it’s industry to make it a better product and to grow financially without killing the aesthetic looks of the uniforms with garish advertising.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 12:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23377″]WRT Real and United, yes they’re common names, but does anyone actually doubt that the team owners were trying to piggyback on the success of recognizable teams when creating their own brand?[/quote]

    In the case of Salt Lake, absolutely they were.

    In the case of DC, it’s not quite as clear. “United” is the single most traditional name a soccer team can have, and as so many teams in so many countries have it, it doesn’t necessarily mean it’s a sop to ManU.

    Besides, I know the people behind the original branding of DC United, and it was more than just imitating ManU.

    [quote]
    And I’ll bet dollars to donuts that the owner of Salt Lake wasn’t thinking to himself, “I really dig those plucky lads in Zaragoza. We should try to emulate them whenever possible,” when he settled on ‘Real Salt Lake.’ Also note that RSL has a multiyear partnership deal with Franco’s team. The ‘Real’ moniker is clearly a nod to the Madridistas.[/quote]

    Oh, no question about it.

    The question then becomes, “So what?” Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.

    Note that we also now have “Toronto FC” in the league, and one of the names being bandied about for a potential Milwaukee MLS team is “AC Milwaukee.”

    So we could have a four-team tournament with Toronto FC, FC Dallas, DC United and AC Milwaukee and get AC/DC to play at halftime of the final. :)

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 12:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23390″][quote comment=”23385″]

    Oh, I know, very steep right. Kind of like the money you are paying Carl Pavano? Is he still alive. You know the Sox will make that back in merch sales, television rights, japanese advertising, tourists, and a few other ways.[/quote]

    Not trying to start a pissing contest here . . .I just think 51.1 is a lot just to negotiate with the guy. It’s gonna cost another 30-40 to sign him. That’s an AWFUL lot of t-shirts, though. And the Sox have already issued a moratorium on ticket price increases on all seats except the premium seats.
    Looks like it might time to bring back the Hood Bottles on the right-field light stantions, the Monster(.com) Seats, etc. . .
    And the price of a Fenway Frank might go up to $7 (or is it already there?)[/quote]

    The only seats with ticket increases are the Premium seats the lower ticket prices will remain the same, kind of a rob from the rich to give to the poor idea. Also, the Hood bottles that were in right field before the new Budweiser section was a means of raising money for cancer research. Hood would donate a certain amount of dollars everytime the Red Sox hit a homerun. They still continue to do this but they have more air time on NESN rather than a big milk chug in the stadium. Also, the Red Sox put big money into the Jimmy Fund and that should be commended.
    I do think that 51.1 million is really high and definitely over paid. The Red Sox wanted to get the best pitcher on the market and with closed bidding no team would have any idea how much another would bid.

  • Nick J | November 17, 2006 at 12:25 pm |

    I have to thank you and Josh Yetmar for showing me the greatest logo I think I’ve ever seen aside from the Washington State logo.

  • Andy F. | November 17, 2006 at 12:28 pm |

    Nike’s new baseball undershirts for next year? Maybe. It might be their new design.
    At least the dot-matrix is gone.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 12:28 pm |

    [quote comment=”23347″]This has nothing to do with the topic, but…

    Minna, I’m not sure what site you saw yesterday, but I can assure you mine does not appear on Google. It’s a small but faithful readership, not even close to what Paul gets here. :o)[/quote]

    I don’t use Google. I have my ways. Let me just say this, Teebz. You had volleyball last night as well as Tuesday night, and you don’t like Yanni. Am I right?

    Oh, to make this about the blog entry, why did ISU change from college to university? I’m sure it’s been addressed—hell, it might even be archived—but I figure an ISU alum could tell me more easily. Thanks, guys.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 12:30 pm |

    Oh, the other thing – to me, Real Salt Lake’s shirt looks a hell of a lot cleaner and classier than all the crap they’ve started hanging on NFL jerseys these days.

    I mean, I know what team you are. I don’t need the little team name embroidery above the number on your chest. It’s stupid.

    The little NFL shield, okay, that was strange, but I got used to it. Then they went to the bigger “NFL Equipment” patch, and that combined with an embroidered script team name that you can hardly read is just stupid.

    Even with a sponsor’s name and a badge, an MLS jersey looks much less garish to me than, say, the Cowboys or the Dolphins’ jerseys.

  • Matt | November 17, 2006 at 12:30 pm |

    First off, great post, KT.

    Though I “no hable espanol,” I do know that Real=Royal. And I had no idea that Brigham Young was an emmissary of a Spanish Monarch.

    Let’s be thankful that altough they picked a somewhat stupid name, they didn’t pick a grossly stupid one. Like, “SLC KillerBEES” complete with a cartoon bee scowling and holding a knife logo. Of course they’ll use a shield with the logo so as to not break one of the unwritten Laws of the Game.

    I’m all for sponsorships in MLS because: they need money to keep talent here, improving the quality of play, keeping talent here, etc… Just as long as the sponsors conform to the team as Pirelli-Inter.

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 12:32 pm |

    However, in the case of Juve, there could be some confusion. A number of teams use that color/design template…Actually, and rather depressingly, the best way to tell those apart would be the advert on the jersey.

    True. And there are only so may color combinations to go around. See also Chelsea/Everton and West Ham/Aston Villa in the EPL alone.

    On a related note, sponsored foreign jerseys in the USA seem particularly effective. I’ve had strangers on the street talk to me about ABN-AMRO (“OMG my brother works for them.” “I have my mortgage through them.”) but nobody ever asks me about Ajax’s chances in the Eredivisie when I sport the jersey. Hell, I didn’t even know they did business over here until people started chatting me up…

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 12:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23344″]I don’t know if this has been brought up yet, but looking at the latest ESPN article I was offended by the new Texas Tech uniforms . Is that a different color red on the side trim stripes than on the numbers and other trim? Is it just me or does that look like crap?[/quote]

    Closing your link

    Andy, it’s not just you. The side trim looks like crap to me, too. I wasn’t offended by it, but I just didn’t understand the change.

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 12:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    Leaving all of that aside, the simple truth is that uniforms with advertisements look ridiculous and completely take away form the brand identity of the team/club.[/quote]I couldn’t disagree more with this. The difference between a global “soccer culture” and every other sport is that soccer is the only game that is truly global. Basketball in Europe is obviously spawned from American basketball, and the same can be said for baseball. On top of the proliferation of leagues around the world playing with precisely the same rules, equipment, and field specifications, soccer is the only sport where international competition is routine and taken seriously. So to say that there’s no such thing as a globalized culture of a particular sport just because American and European basketball teams dress differently is a bit silly.

    All of which is to say that I have absolutely no problem with the addition of sponsorship logos to MLS strips. To be honest, I thought that the old unis with the team name across the front looked hokey and basketball-ish. (Even those few shirts that DON’T carry sponsor logos — Barcelona for one, with the exception of wearing “UNICEF” for charity this season — are simply blank.)

    When you say that advertisements take away from the brand identity of the club, I’ll agree. But most sponsor logos aren’t advertisements. When you have a white rectangle across the butt of the shorts that says “GOLDENPALACE.COM,” that strikes me as bush league. But when I see a clean, color-consistent logo on the chest of a jersey, it doesn’t seem like advertising to me. It’s true that small clubs have a much harder time finding something that looks classy or even reasonable. This stems from the simple fact that they’ve got to take what they can get and simply can’t hold out for something that looks ok.

    As for the Fire having a classic uni, I’m gonna have to disagree. The one linked above is brutal — perhaps the worst in MLS history (which is saying a lot). This season’s are an improvement, but still awful. The white panel across the front for the team name is very Middlesbrough-esque, and that’s a terrible uni too. I’ll give them credit for the badge, though, which is distinctive and should be preserved even if they eventually change to a less-stupid name.

  • Andy L | November 17, 2006 at 12:40 pm |

    I don’t understand why the Real Salt Lake sponsorship deal is that big of a deal. Don’t they have Adidas written on their shirt already? In fact, don’t most uniforms bear the name of a company now? What is the difference if it says Adidas, XanGo or Tostitos (as in the Fiesta Bowl), I don’t think there is one.

  • Pat | November 17, 2006 at 12:42 pm |

    [quote comment=”23390″][quote comment=”23385″]

    Oh, I know, very steep right. Kind of like the money you are paying Carl Pavano? Is he still alive. You know the Sox will make that back in merch sales, television rights, japanese advertising, tourists, and a few other ways.[/quote]

    Not trying to start a pissing contest here . . .I just think 51.1 is a lot just to negotiate with the guy. It’s gonna cost another 30-40 to sign him. That’s an AWFUL lot of t-shirts, though. And the Sox have already issued a moratorium on ticket price increases on all seats except the premium seats.
    Looks like it might time to bring back the Hood Bottles on the right-field light stantions, the Monster(.com) Seats, etc. . .
    And the price of a Fenway Frank might go up to $7 (or is it already there?)[/quote]

    I wasn’t trying to start a pissing contest either. Just being a jerk for one sentence. You’re correct about the ticker prices. But I think the Sox stand to make a lot more money than you think because of this deal. Not only will they be selling t-shirts, jerseys, and tickets (which they can’t really sell any MORE of).

    First of all, NESN will probably start broadcasting in Japan, which will require some money being sent the Sox way since they own NESN. With NESN being seen in Japan you will probably start seeing Japanese advertising on the backstop at Fenway as well as possibly on the outfield walls and maybe a few other places. The same thing happens in Seattle because of Ichiro. There will probably be a lot more tourists coming to Boston, which will not only make money for the city but will attract more people to the Fenway Park tours that happen daily all Spring, Summer and Fall.

    I’m not saying that $51 million wasn’t a lot of money to be spending just for the rights to negotiate with the guy but they’d be hard pressed NOT to make that money back. Plus it’s going to benefit all of major league baseball with the revenue sharing.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 12:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23407″]
    As for the Fire having a classic uni, I’m gonna have to disagree. The one linked above is brutal — perhaps the worst in MLS history (which is saying a lot). This season’s are an improvement, but still awful. The white panel across the front for the team name is very Middlesbrough-esque, and that’s a terrible uni too. I’ll give them credit for the badge, though, which is distinctive and should be preserved even if they eventually change to a less-stupid name.[/quote]

    That wasn’t the best example of the Fire’s kit, but just one I could find quickly. Chicago’s shirt is usually (the two Puma years notwithstanding) one of the simplest and most understated kits in the league (though I’m not a fan of the adidas do-not-adjust-your-set wavy line look they have now).

    And not only is it not a stupid name (it has great significance to the people who live there, who, quite honestly, are going to be the ones supporting the club and not you, wherever you live), but it’s not going to be changed. Sorry about your luck.

  • Phil Pereira | November 17, 2006 at 12:46 pm |

    Regarding soccer naming and jerseys, I didn’t read all the comments, so I apologize if I repeat stuff. Anyway, one of the things that bother me about American soccer is naming. Names are so contrived and trying so hard to be like the NFL or other american teams. Other leagues don’t get cutesy with names, it’s just not a soccer thing to do. Real Salt Lake is the worst. Real is a title bestowed upon teams by the Spanish monarchy, signifying some sort of status, there’s no reason why an American club should imply that it’s related to royalty, when it isn’t. FC Dallas is a name I can get onboard with, FC is a general term used by clubs (keep in mind Manchester United is formally Manchester United Football Club, Portugal has FC Porto). In Portugal, other naming conventions are “Sporting Clube de Lisboa (commonly just called Sporting Lisbon)” and Benfica is called “Sport Lisboa e Benfica” (Benfica being a neighborhood in Lisbon). Houston had a decent thing going with that 1800’s date, but then an issue was raised about killing Mexicans during the founding of the city that they decided to change the name do Dynamo (which is actually a term used for Russian teams). Anyway, names like the Revolution, Wizards, Crew, etc just reek of American marketing and is totally unorganic, and I think thats what bothers me about the league. Every other league has started so organically and succeeded and that’s why leagues like WNBA and MLS struggle. Anyway, that’s all I have right now. I have more I can say later :)

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 12:46 pm |

    [quote comment=”23392″]Fair point. However, in the case of Juventas, there could be some confusion. A number of teams use that color/design template (Notts forest & New Castle come to mind. Actually, and rather depressingly, the best way to tell those apart would be the advert on the jersey.[/quote]Except that all of these teams have distinctive badges. I would suggest that any semi-serious soccer fan (even an American!) could identify the logos of the top five clubs in the four or five biggest leagues in the world, and anyone who is more than semi-serious could probably identify those of every team in the top flights of the major European leagues. Juve v. Newcastle is a no-brainer.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 12:46 pm |

    By the way, that Fire shirt couldn’t possibly be the worst in MLS history.

    this one from the late, lamented Tampa Bay Mutiny was bad because it was Kappa’s tight-fitting tour-de-France-type shirt, but for a look at really bad unis, look here.

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 12:48 pm |

    So we could have a four-team tournament with Toronto FC, FC Dallas, DC United and AC Milwaukee and get AC/DC to play at halftime of the final. :)

    I’d be there! Too bad MKE is going for such a bland handle. Why not something German? I really think they should strike a deal with the local amateur powerhouse and call themselves the Bavarians.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 12:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”23376″]from yesterday…

    [quote comment=”23262″]Next time, I’ll have to turn it on earlier and see what high school Garnett attended.[/quote]

    in south carolina he went to mauldin, then when he moved to chicago, he went to farragut academy.

    [/quote]

    todd k., I was going to be snarky and say I knew that (the latter), but I didn’t know the former, so thanks.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 12:50 pm |

    Matt B (is that Bernhardt?): That’s just one of the names under consideration. It’s not a lock that it would be AC Milwaukee.

    Bayern Milwaukee would be sweet, though, wouldn’t it? ;)

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 12:52 pm |

    [quote comment=”23414″]So we could have a four-team tournament with Toronto FC, FC Dallas, DC United and AC Milwaukee and get AC/DC to play at halftime of the final. :)

    I’d be there! Too bad MKE is going for such a bland handle. Why not something German? I really think they should strike a deal with the local amateur powerhouse and call themselves the Bavarians.[/quote]

    Bayern Milwaukee???

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 12:55 pm |

    [quote comment=”23410″]And not only is it not a stupid name (it has great significance to the people who live there, who, quite honestly, are going to be the ones supporting the club and not you, wherever you live), but it’s not going to be changed. Sorry about your luck.[/quote]I couldn’t care less what name they do or do not use, but I’d be surprised if any American teams still have names like “Fire” or “Crew” in twenty years. I think “Rapids” and “MetroStars” are just as bad, but the American-ness isn’t really my complaint — it’s really the idiotic collective-naming that gets me. “Heat” and “Wild” (the worst) and “Green Wave” are just as terrible, and so were the Dallas Burn, the Dallas Freeze, and the Fort Worth Fire.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 12:57 pm |

    [quote comment=”23391″]Minna,

    Good news!![/quote]

    Thanks, GoTerriers. I was worried about my boy, so you made my day! Don’t like the beard, though. I don’t like a lot af facial hair—but I love his mane.

  • Matt B | November 17, 2006 at 12:59 pm |

    Bayern Milwaukee is too contrived. I’d use the anglicized word. Or really be unique and leave the location totally out of it. Bavarian Soccer Club?

    And the Fire’s powder blue third jersey by Puma that was a mock-up of the city flag was perfect. Well, powder blue isn’t a fire-related color, but there’s no need to be too literal!

    And the B is indeed a German surname, but not Bernhardt.

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 1:00 pm |

    [quote comment=”23413″]By the way, that Fire shirt couldn’t possibly be the worst in MLS history.

    this one from the late, lamented Tampa Bay Mutiny was bad because it was Kappa’s tight-fitting tour-de-France-type shirt, but for a look at really bad unis, look here.[/quote]I’ve got to admit a little overstatement on that one, beause the inaugural MLS unis were just absolutely nausea-inducing. I will say, though (and this is a matter of opinion, obviously), that the Fire’s Puma shirts were much, much worse than the Kappa Mutiny ones… even considering the awful tight-torso overlong-sleeves fit of the latter.

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 1:03 pm |

    [quote comment=”23418″]I couldn’t care less what name they do or do not use, but I’d be surprised if any American teams still have names like “Fire” or “Crew” in twenty years.[/quote]

    Well, we’ll see. Those two have tremendous local significance (the former historical, the latter just by virtue of being Columbus’ first big-time pro sports team and having been around for 11 years to this point).

    There was talk that the Rapids might be renamed Colorado Arsenal, but that didn’t happen. I don’t expect we’ll see much in the way of re-naming, we’ve seen a bit of that already (Clash to Earthquakes, Wiz to Wizards, MetroStars to Red Bulls, Burn to FC Dallas). I think going forward we’ll see more traditional names.

    But let’s be honest, here – we have so many damn teams in so many sports that we’re running out.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 1:04 pm |

    [quote comment=”23413″]…but for a look at really bad unis, look here.[/quote]

    Quite possibly the coolest picture ever – anyone know where I could find it in a larger size, so I can use it for my desktop?

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 1:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”23424″][quote comment=”23413″]…but for a look at really bad unis, look here.[/quote]

    Quite possibly the coolest picture ever – anyone know where I could find it in a larger size, so I can use it for my desktop?[/quote]Perhaps the only good thing about that whole farrago of ugliness and non-sporting colors is the socks.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 1:09 pm |

    With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?

  • KT | November 17, 2006 at 1:11 pm |

    Major Indoor Soccer League teams and United Soccer League teams have had shirt sponsors for years. They usually look a bit better than the old Wichita Wings, who had a huge Taco Bell logo on the front of their shirts.

  • BtotheE | November 17, 2006 at 1:11 pm |

    If we keep talking about soccer, I am gonna start bringing this up. Just kidding, I could never do that.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 1:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    How about everyone on the Michigan sidelines wearing aviator sunglasses?

  • Dave A | November 17, 2006 at 1:23 pm |

    Years ago, I heard that all Eastern European teams named Dynamo, or Dinamo, were sponsored by the secret police.

  • Si | November 17, 2006 at 1:25 pm |

    I work in the Pressbox at Oberlin College (DIII school in Ohio) and we had a similar problem in our last home game. Wittenberg wore white like Miami and their numbers became harder and harder to read as the game went on. Players like linebackers and safteys especially were dificult because of all the tackles they were involved in. The main problem was that all 3 starting linebackers had numbers in the 40’s, and often the second number was hard to read

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 1:27 pm |

    [quote comment=”23409″]

    I’m not saying that $51 million wasn’t a lot of money to be spending just for the rights to negotiate with the guy but they’d be hard pressed NOT to make that money back. Plus it’s going to benefit all of major league baseball with the revenue sharing.[/quote]

    Ok. I have to comment on this. It is NOT to the benefit of the whole league when the Red Sox’s bid for the right to talk to a player is only twelve million less than the Twins’ entire payroll for 2006.

    Here is a good article debunking the myth of revenue sharing:

    parity my as’s

    Will the Red Sox recoup the money? Undoubtably, but it only benefits them.

  • V8Cougar | November 17, 2006 at 1:31 pm |

    Don’t know if this was ever shown, but here’s UF’s Reggie Nelson wearing a Nike undershirt sleeve on his head. I know several other players do this as well.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 1:36 pm |

    [quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?

  • Haywood | November 17, 2006 at 1:36 pm |

    Now here’s an interesting Uni:

    Motorhead

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 17, 2006 at 1:46 pm |

    [quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    none at all. no alteration.

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 1:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”23435″][quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?[/quote]

    Minna I don’t think they should play and I hope out of respect they change the name of their band. But, they do seem a “little” bit out-there. So who knows?

  • Natron44 | November 17, 2006 at 1:57 pm |

    [quote comment=”23436″]Now here’s an interesting Uni:

    Motorhead[/quote]

    That is awesome! It’s the best cross promotion I’ve seen since this or this.

  • Andy#11 | November 17, 2006 at 1:58 pm |

    [quote comment=”23438″][quote comment=”23435″][quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?[/quote]

    Minna I don’t think they should play and I hope out of respect they change the name of their band. But, they do seem a “little” bit out-there. So who knows?[/quote]

    From that band’s website:
    “BO SCHEMBECHLER: OSU’S MOST VALIANT FOE: The band is crushed to learn of the death of Bo Schembechler. We named this band after Coach Schembechler to honor him as the face of Wolverine football. We have never wished ill will upon him in any way and have always wished him the best. When we learned that Bo had seen our web site and was amused by it we were delighted. We were simply delighted. He said to those with him as he read it, “See, I still matter in Columbus!” That may have been the greatest understatement in football history. We believe that he took the band’s name as the compliment that it was meant as and that he was flattered by it. We wish to extend our deepest and most heartfelt sympathies to his family. We are truly sorry for their loss.”

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 1:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”23438″][quote comment=”23435″][quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?[/quote]

    Minna I don’t think they should play and I hope out of respect they change the name of their band. But, they do seem a “little” bit out-there. So who knows?[/quote]

    dchis, I agree. I’m all for out-there and different and edgy, but I’m also for respect and consideration. I don’t think they should go as the group, but I bet they will.

    On a strictly uni basis, I pick (t)OSU over Mee-chigan. I know this is sacrilege, but I am not crazy about the Michigan helmets.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:02 pm |

    [quote comment=”23440″]

    From that band’s website:
    “BO SCHEMBECHLER: OSU’S MOST VALIANT FOE: The band is crushed to learn of the death of Bo Schembechler. We named this band after Coach Schembechler to honor him as the face of Wolverine football. We have never wished ill will upon him in any way and have always wished him the best. When we learned that Bo had seen our web site and was amused by it we were delighted. We were simply delighted. He said to those with him as he read it, “See, I still matter in Columbus!” That may have been the greatest understatement in football history. We believe that he took the band’s name as the compliment that it was meant as and that he was flattered by it. We wish to extend our deepest and most heartfelt sympathies to his family. We are truly sorry for their loss.”[/quote]

    Andy, thanks for pointing that out. I am glad they posted that. Shows they weren’t doing it maliciously. Good for them.

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 2:06 pm |

    [quote comment=”23441″][quote comment=”23438″][quote comment=”23435″][quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?[/quote]

    Minna I don’t think they should play and I hope out of respect they change the name of their band. But, they do seem a “little” bit out-there. So who knows?[/quote]

    dchis, I agree. I’m all for out-there and different and edgy, but I’m also for respect and consideration. I don’t think they should go as the group, but I bet they will.

    On a strictly uni basis, I pick (t)OSU over Mee-chigan. I know this is sacrilege, but I am not crazy about the Michigan helmets.[/quote]

    OH and the Michigan pants!?!? NO STIPES!!! And Tshimanga Biakabutuka ran for 313 yards in that 1995 game in one of the best upsets of the rivalry.

  • Fantos | November 17, 2006 at 2:19 pm |

    I’m shocked to see all these people talk about how no American sport would ever put advertisements on their uniforms.

    Last time I checked, the fastest growing sport in America, NASCAR, was nothing BUT advertisements! And if you say it’s not uni-related because the adverts are on the car and not the driver, just look at some of their driving suits.

  • Seth H | November 17, 2006 at 2:23 pm |

    The ones that have photos of players on them give me the feeling of a nice friendly rivalry. I know it’s not a heated rivalry like some others but therer is some history.

    “Some” history? I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt that you were being ironic. How about the third most contested football series? The game known as The Game? Played in alternate years at the oldest football stadium in the country? You could also check out Wikipedia (under the entry “The Game” of course) to find about more about The Game’s significance. http://en.wikipedia....

    As for “not a heated rivalry,” I’ll just put that down to ignorance.

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 17, 2006 at 2:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23435″][quote comment=”23426″]With Coach Schembechler passing away today, what kind of tribute do you think we’ll see on the Wolverine uniforms tomorrow?[/quote]

    I’m wondering what this group will do for the big game.

    Warning, may be considered insensitive:

    They can’t play, can they?[/quote]

    there is michigan response band to that called the dropkick woody’s (obvious ripoff of my fave band the dropkick murphys)

    anyone know if there is a band like that from chapel hill who just busts on dook?

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 2:25 pm |

    [quote comment=”23448″]I’m shocked to see all these people talk about how no American sport would ever put advertisements on their uniforms.

    Last time I checked, the fastest growing sport in America, NASCAR, was nothing BUT advertisements! And if you say it’s not uni-related because the adverts are on the car and not the driver, just look at some of their driving suits.[/quote]

    That’s if you believe that NASCAR is a sport.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:26 pm |

    [quote comment=”23448″]I’m shocked to see all these people talk about how no American sport would ever put advertisements on their uniforms.

    Last time I checked, the fastest growing sport in America, NASCAR, was nothing BUT advertisements! And if you say it’s not uni-related because the adverts are on the car and not the driver, just look at some of their driving suits.[/quote]

    That’s because most Americans rank car racing as one step below futbol.

    As for soccer kits—I prefer them without the adverts, but I understand the need. They are not bleeding money like the Red Sox are.

    Fantos, fastest growing? Really? I’m assuming you mean by percentage.

  • Fantos | November 17, 2006 at 2:27 pm |

    I don’t think NASCAR is a sport. In fact, can’t stand it.

    I’ve played soccer for nearly two decades now and it is truly my first love in sports. I was just citing an example from American culture where advertising is an acceptable norm.

  • dchis | November 17, 2006 at 2:31 pm |

    [quote comment=”23453″]I don’t think NASCAR is a sport. In fact, can’t stand it.

    I’ve played soccer for nearly two decades now and it is truly my first love in sports. I was just citing an example from American culture where advertising is an acceptable norm.[/quote]

    Ok Ok. Understand your argument. I also agree that NASCAR is not a sport. I mean it’s a machine driven by a person around a track. Now I understand it’s hot and the G-Forces but they aren’t running the track!?!? Running it for that length is much harder and the runner is actually doing the thing. That’s a sport.

  • Teebz | November 17, 2006 at 2:32 pm |

    [quote comment=”23402″]
    I don’t use Google. I have my ways. Let me just say this, Teebz. You had volleyball last night as well as Tuesday night, and you don’t like Yanni. Am I right?
    [/quote]

    Glad to see you listened when we chatted. I left enough clues there to find me. :o)

    In regards to that, most of the people come there to laugh, so sports doesn’t get mentioned a lot. That’s why I come here.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:33 pm |

    Read #3 and #10 to find the items most pertinent to this blog. #3 because it’s uni-related, and #10 because of the big discussion yesterday.

    Snicker

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:39 pm |

    [quote comment=”23455″][quote comment=”23402″]
    I don’t use Google. I have my ways. Let me just say this, Teebz. You had volleyball last night as well as Tuesday night, and you don’t like Yanni. Am I right?
    [/quote]

    Glad to see you listened when we chatted. I left enough clues there to find me. :o)

    In regards to that, most of the people come there to laugh, so sports doesn’t get mentioned a lot. That’s why I come here.[/quote]

    I am Queen of Finding Things! Your site is amusing. You could still throw in something sports-related, you know. There are plenty amusing things in sports. Nice site, by the way. No pics of you? That’s not right.

    Now I see why you told me not to hate on Christmas T. Cratchit.

    M. Scrooge

  • Natron44 | November 17, 2006 at 2:39 pm |

    [quote comment=”23454″][quote comment=”23453″]I don’t think NASCAR is a sport. In fact, can’t stand it.

    I’ve played soccer for nearly two decades now and it is truly my first love in sports. I was just citing an example from American culture where advertising is an acceptable norm.[/quote]

    Ok Ok. Understand your argument. I also agree that NASCAR is not a sport. I mean it’s a machine driven by a person around a track. Now I understand it’s hot and the G-Forces but they aren’t running the track!?!? Running it for that length is much harder and the runner is actually doing the thing. That’s a sport.[/quote]

    In general, I would agree that NASCAR isn’t a sport either, but I might be willing to classify the guys in the pit crew as much of an athlete as a place kicker. There’s some speed and coordination needed in the pit crew… Except for the gas can guy – he’s usually a chocolate donut away from disaster.

    Although, the ads on the car aren’t that bad – the future looks far worse.

  • ThresherK | November 17, 2006 at 2:40 pm |

    Greetings, Pantonistas, and this is as good a time as any for your Grey Cup Uni Preview:

    With their alternate orange helmet, BC can lay claim to Best Orange-Black Feline-Named American Football Uniform until somebody knocks some sense into the Bengals.

    Montreal ran out of numbers for the jersey shoulders and resorted to those little ones you buy at the hardware store for your mailbox.

    My prediction? Even though they took my Roughriders in the Western Final, BC looks much sharper than Montreal and so deserves the win.

    (I couldn’t get complete links for either look–curse this dial-up.)

  • Mark in Shiga | November 17, 2006 at 2:40 pm |

    Fantos, wasn’t NASCAR in severe financial distress a few decades ago when the advertisements started getting outrageous?

    Also, with auto racing being an individual sport, it’s not so jarring to see a single company logo adorning a car, since there’s no team name for the corporate stuff to upstage. Same with the golf hats’ sponsors. But I must admit that I don’t follow auto racing too closely.

    I’m disappointed to see so many people not only not minding, but actually defending advertising on soccer jerseys. This is a recent phenomenon and isn’t part of soccer tradition at all. It’s nothing more than a slippery slope — when Japan’s J-League was formed in the early 1990s, they justified adding big ads to their otherwise team-name-only jerseys by saying that lots of European teams were doing it and that they needed money to attract star players to join their new league, and of course more than a decade later the ads have never left.

    My team, Kyoto Purple Sanga, at least does fans the service of being sponsored by local corporation Kyocera (Kyoto Ceramic), so the sponsor’s name is linked with the team’s, but the jerseys without ads are much more aesthetically pleasing, with only the team crest and the number.

    Here’s an idea: why not have sponsors put the team logo on their products instead of the reverse situation that we’re in now? Asahi Beer does this with the Hanshin Tigers. Nobody wants ugly Asahi Beer logos on the players’ chests, but beer drinkers are delighted to see Tiger logos on their beer, so Asahi makes some money without offending the purists!

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:51 pm |

    [quote comment=”23463″]

    Here’s an idea: why not have sponsors put the team logo on their products instead of the reverse situation that we’re in now? Asahi Beer does this with the Hanshin Tigers. Nobody wants ugly Asahi Beer logos on the players’ chests, but beer drinkers are delighted to see Tiger logos on their beer, so Asahi makes some money without offending the purists![/quote]

    Mark in Shiga, I like this idea a lot. I wouldn’t buy a product specifically because it had a team logo on it (except, perhaps, for Polamalu Hair Spray), but I think it’s better this way than the other. However, I don’t think most companies would go for this because then people think of the team rather than the brand when buying whatever product the team is trying to sell. Plus, they would make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.

  • jeff in detroit | November 17, 2006 at 2:52 pm |

    not uni related but is this the first time um-osu is not being played at noon?

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”23464″]

    Plus, they would make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    Damn it. I stopped proofing awhile ago. That should read:

    Plus, they would have to make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.

  • Banker Bill | November 17, 2006 at 3:19 pm |

    [quote comment=”23388″][quote comment=”23381″][quote comment=”23380″]You know, as has been pointed out in this blog, in Europe the Basketball teams wear adverts on their uniforms.

    Where as in the North American Teams don’t. So, how does one explain this? Is it that there was a schism in the “Basketball cultures” or is it that there are different cultural norms in North America and Europe? I would tend to think it is the latter. Any claim that there is an overarching soccer culture, that transcends actual culture, seems a bit of a stretch.

    [/quote]

    I’m gonna go with the fact that most European leagues don’t have multi-million dollar television contracts and need to sell advertising space whever they can find an inch just to make ends meet . . .(Sort of like what the Red Sox are going to have to do to pay the $51.1 million for the right to negotiate with Daisuke Matsuzaka (good thing I’m not a bitter Yankees Fan, but c’mon . . .$51.1 MILLION . .that’s way too steep)[/quote]

    51.1 Million is insane. However, part of the justification was that the money would be recouped in merchandise sales, such as an Matsuzaka jerseys (unfettered by advertising)[/quote]

    Keep in mind this…if Matsuzaka and the Sox do not come to terms on a contract in 30 days, the Red Sox do not have to pay a red cent of that bid. I don’t think they have any intention of signin him – they bid that to block him from the Yankees. If they DO agree on a contract, Boras is going to want around 3 years @ $45M – add that to the bid – that’s 3 years for $96M…$32M a year for a pitcher who has never pitched in the big leagues.

  • now_a_hoo | November 17, 2006 at 3:21 pm |

    Chivas USA has nothing to do with scotch. The MLS team is the sister team of Club Deportivo Guadalajara, known commonly as “Chivas”, or “goats.” I think it’s pretty cool. Just as cool as calling a team the “Red Bulls” is dumb.

    The team’s explanation is here:

  • now_a_hoo | November 17, 2006 at 3:25 pm |

  • now_a_hoo | November 17, 2006 at 3:26 pm |

    Ugh. Sorry. One more try.

    http://chivas.usa.ml...

  • Fred | November 17, 2006 at 3:26 pm |

    “The image problem is a subtle way of talking about black ballplayers and how they appear to the populace,” Hunter said. “When we had our last round of negotiations, David told me that he was consulting with one of President Bush’s political consultants. The issue was, what they can do to make the game and players more appealing to the red states?”

    Easy. Make the basketball a football, put helmets on the players, change the court to a grass field in 10 yard increments of 10, and take down the backboards and add field goals posts.

    David, you want the NBA game more appealing, turn it into the NFL.

  • Mark in Shiga | November 17, 2006 at 3:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”23466″]
    Plus, they would have to make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    I don’t think it would cost that much, Minna — magazines do this already. For example, growing up in the northeast US, every baseball preview magazine like Street and Smith’s had a Met or Yankee on the cover). For things like food and drinks, it would be a simple matter of printing up a special package, and they already do this for the Christmas holidays or an Olympic promotion or whatever.

    I guess the problem is that if a company got too associated with a team, haters of the team would boycot the products. Even people who despise Inter Milan can still buy Pirelli tires even though the Pirelli logo is on the Inter jerseys, whereas if the Inter logo were on all the PIrelli products, Inter fans would become hugh brand-loyalists while supporters of all the other teams would boycott Pirelli.

    There should be some kind of work-around though. At the very least, make these jersey-defiling advertisers sign fifty-year contracts with the teams so that the team can work with them to create something pleasing and non-garish, instead of having the advertiser change frequently and turning the jerseys into rotating billboards.

    Or do something subtler, like the Red Bulls of MLS, the New York Jets and Hess, and the Toronto Blue Jays with Labatt’s Blue. The team colors or nickname allude to the sponsor without becomnig an all-out assault on decency. The Jers and the Hess gas stations are particularly inoffensive.

  • Banker Bill | November 17, 2006 at 3:35 pm |

    [quote comment=”23466″][quote comment=”23464″]

    Plus, they would make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    Damn it. I stopped proofing awhile ago. That should read:

    Plus, they would have to make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    Quite alliterative today, Minna…

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 17, 2006 at 3:38 pm |

    something that ive wondered for years…
    are the jets colors a direct reference to leon hess’ gas stations?

  • Ed | November 17, 2006 at 3:43 pm |

    FWIW, I appreciate the discussion that has ensued about the MLS team names – it’s been educational.

    ed

  • ard | November 17, 2006 at 3:47 pm |

    Can’t help but add my two cents: For those that don’t see NASCAR as a sport, I suggest you read this or this. They physical and mental strain on drivers is enormous. Also, many pit crews have ex college football players working for them. Try jacking up a 3,000 pound car, holding a 90 pound gas can, or changing four 80 pound tires sometime… in 13-15 seconds.

    As to the advertisements on the cars and suits, a top NASACAR team requires at least $20 million per year to run competitively. While that might not be much to the Bo Sox, it is a lot when you have teams running 2-4 cars.

    Now, I would draw the line at mentioning the race sponser in the opening invocation (which has happened more than once.)

  • Judd | November 17, 2006 at 3:50 pm |

    Paul, that was me that sent in the Yale-Harvard program link..

    The Game is being played tomorrow, and I an’t talking about Ohio State – Michigan!!!!

    Jonathan from New Haven

  • Miguel L. | November 17, 2006 at 3:58 pm |

    Dont know if its been brought up, but on the cover of the new SI Tyler Handsborough is wearing one of the new Nike jerseys and the jumpman logo is not visible because it has an American flag over it. The shorts do have the Jumpman logo.

    http://dynamic.si.cn...

  • Jeff I | November 17, 2006 at 4:05 pm |

    I think Phil Kessel may be wearing skorts!

    http://www.bostonrin...

  • N. | November 17, 2006 at 4:09 pm |

    I may be retarded, but I have a bit of a problem with the explanation given for the placement of the apostrophe in the Athletics’ branding. Why would the possessive of As be As’s and not As’?? My name is Nicholas, and the possessive for that is Nicholas’ — NOT Nicholas’s. I’m still not satisfied.

  • Jeff I | November 17, 2006 at 4:13 pm |

    [quote comment=”23482″]I may be retarded, but I have a bit of a problem with the explanation given for the placement of the apostrophe in the Athletics’ branding. Why would the possessive of As be As’s and not As’?? My name is Nicholas, and the possessive for that is Nicholas’ — NOT Nicholas’s. I’m still not satisfied.[/quote]

    I think it’s less of an apostrophe used for identifying possession than it is for just an abbreviation.

  • Andy#11 | November 17, 2006 at 4:14 pm |

    On the topic of sports which require athleticism but still shouldn’t really be considered “sports”…

    Race walking.

  • Miguel | November 17, 2006 at 4:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”23477″]Can’t help but add my two cents: For those that don’t see NASCAR as a sport, I suggest you read this or this. The physical and mental strain on drivers is enormous…[/quote]

    Just because there is “physical and mental strain” doth not make it a sport. Nobody calls firefighting or working on an oil rig a “sport”.

  • ThresherK | November 17, 2006 at 4:17 pm |

    One additional item about ads on MLS jerseys?

    The Game Never Stops.

    American football is, as the axiom goes, a combination of two favored American pastimes: Group violence interspersed with committee meetings.

    Predictable stoppages in play for everything I can think of besides soccer and auto racing means fans and cameras have time to look at ads elsewhere, like that old Schaefer (Hit/Error) sign which used to be on Ebbets Field’s right-field wall.

    Ergo, ads on soccer unis and race cars? Not so bad to my eyes.

    For Red Bulls, remember the taxicab on the original MetroStars logo? If Brooklyn could spawn the Trolley Dodgers, couldn’t Manhattan (let’s pretend it’s not in New Jersey) get a colorful name for those cheating death by being anywhere near a taxi on 5th Avenue?

    As long as the Revs don’t change from their name or their NationalFlagBlue-Red-and-White.

  • Andy#11 | November 17, 2006 at 4:19 pm |

    [quote comment=”23484″]On the topic of sports which require athleticism but still shouldn’t really be considered “sports”…

    Race walking.[/quote]

    I should have said, On the topic of competitions which require athleticism…

  • Richard | November 17, 2006 at 4:25 pm |

    what ever happened to uniform conversations?

    I thought this was what Paul’s vision was, not a bunch of people ranting and raving about what is and what is not a sport in their minds…

  • Chris Mewett | November 17, 2006 at 4:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”23463″]I’m disappointed to see so many people not only not minding, but actually defending advertising on soccer jerseys.[/quote]The point that I’m making is that I think there’s a useful distinction to be made between having a shirt sponsor and festooning your uni with advertisements.

    Displaying a sponsor logo on your shirt and NASCARing-out your uni are not the same thing. There’s no reason to believe that MLS teams will engage in the latter practice, particularly if we’re going off the example mockup of RSL’s shirt.

  • Taylor | November 17, 2006 at 4:31 pm |

    [quote comment=”23479″]Paul, that was me that sent in the Yale-Harvard program link..

    The Game is being played tomorrow, and I an’t talking about Ohio State – Michigan!!!!

    Jonathan from New Haven[/quote]

    The GEORGE MASON-Wichita St. game? Go Patriots!!!

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 4:35 pm |

    [quote comment=”23445″]

    OH and the Michigan pants!?!? NO STIPES!!! And Tshimanga Biakabutuka ran for 313 yards in that 1995 game in one of the best upsets of the rivalry.[/quote]

    dchis, I don’t mind the no-stripe look—more sacrilege, I know—and I like the blue and yellow….It’s just thouse damn helmets.

    Here is more on that band and playing:

    RIP

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 4:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23474″][quote comment=”23466″][quote comment=”23464″]

    Plus, they would make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    Damn it. I stopped proofing awhile ago. That should read:

    Plus, they would have to make different packaging for different regions, which is probably prohibitively expensive.[/quote]

    Quite alliterative today, Minna…[/quote]

    Banker B, or just damn repetitive, verbose, gratuitous and crotchety.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 4:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23467″]

    Keep in mind this…if Matsuzaka and the Sox do not come to terms on a contract in 30 days, the Red Sox do not have to pay a red cent of that bid. I don’t think they have any intention of signin him – they bid that to block him from the Yankees. If they DO agree on a contract, Boras is going to want around 3 years @ $45M – add that to the bid – that’s 3 years for $96M…$32M a year for a pitcher who has never pitched in the big leagues.[/quote]

    I think this guy is too good a pitcher for this too be a Keep-Him-Away-From-The-Yankees Smokescreen. Besides, it’s doubtful theat Matsuzaka would return to Seibu for the $3 million that they can afford him at for 2007. Even with Boras(s) as his agent, the player has to have SOME say in his own signability.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 4:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23488″]what ever happened to uniform conversations?

    I thought this was what Paul’s vision was, not a bunch of people ranting and raving about what is and what is not a sport in their minds…[/quote]

    Richard, it’s there somewhere. I think people are extra-hopped up this week for whatever reason, but there is still content to be had. Just look for new posts rather than threads—the new posts are more likely to contain actual uni-content.

    Hey, Ek! Maybe it’s time to reconsider a message board approach? Just a suggestion.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 4:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”23494″][quote comment=”23488″]what ever happened to uniform conversations?

    I thought this was what Paul’s vision was, not a bunch of people ranting and raving about what is and what is not a sport in their minds…[/quote]

    Richard, it’s there somewhere. I think people are extra-hopped up this week for whatever reason, but there is still content to be had. Just look for new posts rather than threads—the new posts are more likely to contain actual uni-content.

    Hey, Ek! Maybe it’s time to reconsider a message board approach? Just a suggestion.[/quote]

    Minna, you are far kinder than I would have been (though I stopped myself for fear of being admonished).

    Richard, if you don’t like the topic of conversation, don’t complain, CHANGE THE SUBJECT!!

  • ard | November 17, 2006 at 4:52 pm |

    [quote comment=”23485″][quote comment=”23477″]Can’t help but add my two cents: For those that don’t see NASCAR as a sport, I suggest you read this or this. The physical and mental strain on drivers is enormous…[/quote]

    Just because there is “physical and mental strain” doth not make it a sport. Nobody calls firefighting or working on an oil rig a “sport”.[/quote]

    I agree, but I don’t see the competition aspect of firefighting or working on an oil rig. I don’t see tens (or hundreds) of thousands of people watching firefighting or people working on an oil rig. Just because there is not a ball involved does not mean it is not a sport. I’m pretty sure you understood what I meant by “physical and mental strain”.

    To bring it back to unis, I think there could be some great discussion regarding this, this, or this (note the shoes, it’s everywhere).

  • Banker Bill | November 17, 2006 at 4:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”23494″][quote comment=”23488″]what ever happened to uniform conversations?

    I thought this was what Paul’s vision was, not a bunch of people ranting and raving about what is and what is not a sport in their minds…[/quote]

    Richard, it’s there somewhere. I think people are extra-hopped up this week for whatever reason, but there is still content to be had. Just look for new posts rather than threads—the new posts are more likely to contain actual uni-content.

    Hey, Ek! Maybe it’s time to reconsider a message board approach? Just a suggestion.[/quote]

    The forum here is about ATHLETIC uniforms…and sometimes the conversation deviates a little bit – if that happens, not necessarily a horrible thing. I liken this place as going to a bar and talking sports while working – yes, 95% of the conversation is uni-related, but if that’s all anyone was allowed to talk about, this would get pretty boring pretty fast. I mean, unles you’re looking at the NFL rulebook, a person’s hair is not considered uniform, but I would never deny Minna her Polamalu fascination. So lighten up on the gulag stance of “ALL UNIFIORM ALL THE TIME” – it’s just not worth getting upset about!

  • Paul Lukas | November 17, 2006 at 4:56 pm |

    FWIW: I think NASCAR is absolutely a sport (although not one that I’m particularly interested in). But the issue of advertising on a soccer uni as opposed to advertising on NASCAR autos (or on boxing trunks, or bowling shirts…) is an apples/oranges comparison, because soccer is a team sport while NASCAR (and boxing, and bowling…) is not. A team is a brand, it’s what you root for, and the uniform transcends the identities of the people wearing it. That’s why advertising on team uniforms is offensive. But individual sports are different — I’d still rather not see ads on boxing trunks and such, but it’s not as bad as an ad on a team uni.

    And please, don’t tell me about NASCAR pit teams and all that — from a rooting perspective, it’s still an individual sport.

  • N. | November 17, 2006 at 4:56 pm |

    [quote comment=”23483″][quote comment=”23482″]I may be retarded, but I have a bit of a problem with the explanation given for the placement of the apostrophe in the Athletics’ branding. Why would the possessive of As be As’s and not As’?? My name is Nicholas, and the possessive for that is Nicholas’ — NOT Nicholas’s. I’m still not satisfied.[/quote]

    I think it’s less of an apostrophe used for identifying possession than it is for just an abbreviation.[/quote]

    OK, I get that. But the defense that w/o the use of the apostrophe in As it would then be necessary to make the possessive As’s befuddles me.

    read it for yourself:

    Second, if the club chose ‘As’ to abbreviate its nickname, then the possessive case of that contraction would be ‘As’s’. That spelling is far too close to a vulgar reference to the buttocks, and to the definition of a stupid, obstinate, or perverse person, to ever be preferable as a team moniker.”

  • Richard | November 17, 2006 at 4:58 pm |

    [quote comment=”23496″][quote comment=”23494″][quote comment=”23488″]what ever happened to uniform conversations?

    I thought this was what Paul’s vision was, not a bunch of people ranting and raving about what is and what is not a sport in their minds…[/quote]

    Richard, it’s there somewhere. I think people are extra-hopped up this week for whatever reason, but there is still content to be had. Just look for new posts rather than threads—the new posts are more likely to contain actual uni-content.

    Hey, Ek! Maybe it’s time to reconsider a message board approach? Just a suggestion.[/quote]

    Minna, you are far kinder than I would have been (though I stopped myself for fear of being admonished).

    Richard, if you don’t like the topic of conversation, don’t complain, CHANGE THE SUBJECT!![/quote]

    I’m trying – and have been working on it. I think there have been lots of good comments on uniforms recemtly, but this afternoon’s rant is ridiculous. Thanks Minna for being so nice.

  • Banker Bill | November 17, 2006 at 5:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”23499″]FWIW: I think NASCAR is absolutely a sport (although not one that I’m particularly interested in). But the issue of advertising on a soccer uni as opposed to advertising on NASCAR autos (or on boxing trunks, or bowling shirts…) is an apples/oranges comparison, because soccer is a team sport while NASCAR (and boxing, and bowling…) is not. A team is a brand, it’s what you root for, and the uniform transcends the identities of the people wearing it. That’s why advertising on team uniforms is offensive. But individual sports are different — I’d still rather not see ads on boxing trunks and such, but it’s not as bad as an ad on a team uni.

    And please, don’t tell me about NASCAR pit teams and all that — from a rooting perspective, it’s still an individual sport.[/quote]

    Perfectly stated, oh esteemed leader. Especially now that so many drivers switch cars year in and year out – I am a Bobby Labonte fan and this year I stopped wearing all my #18 gear and had to get some #43 gear. Nobody watches races to see the “#8 Budweiser Chevorlet” – you watch to see Dale Earnhardt Jr.

    Besides, advertising creeps everywhere in sports anymore. So long as it stays off the uniform, I’m cool with that. There’s enough space to advertise on outfield walls, scoreboards, the boards of a hockey rink, even the net that catches field goals. Let the uniforms be a little sacred.

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 5:07 pm |

    [quote comment=”23501″]

    I’m trying – and have been working on it. I think there have been lots of good comments on uniforms recemtly, but this afternoon’s rant is ridiculous. Thanks Minna for being so nice.[/quote]

    Sorry, man. Didn’t mean to snap. It’s been an interesting Friday at work. Good news is, I’m off to a hockey game. Bad news is BU is winless in their last 5. Maybe they’ll wear these throwback jerseys for a little change of puck luck tonight.

    If only we could convince Providence to wear their long pants throwbacks (can’t find a picture . .Dan from PC HELP!!)

  • GoTerriers | November 17, 2006 at 5:11 pm |

    [quote comment=”23503″]

    If only we could convince Providence to wear their long pants throwbacks (can’t find a picture . .Dan from PC HELP!!)[/quote]

    Or maybe the black and white pinstripes . . .I can’t decide which I liked better. As long as they’ve got the Skating Friar, though . . .
    However inappropriate it was a friend of mine used to bring a Skating Friar doll to games with a noose around it’s neck, hanging on a stick . . .

    Pope on a Rope! (sorry . . never claimed BU Fans had much class)

  • Patrick O'Donnell | November 17, 2006 at 5:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”23499″]FWIW: I think NASCAR is absolutely a sport (although not one that I’m particularly interested in). But the issue of advertising on a soccer uni as opposed to advertising on NASCAR autos (or on boxing trunks, or bowling shirts…) is an apples/oranges comparison, because soccer is a team sport while NASCAR (and boxing, and bowling…) is not. A team is a brand, it’s what you root for, and the uniform transcends the identities of the people wearing it. That’s why advertising on team uniforms is offensive. But individual sports are different — I’d still rather not see ads on boxing trunks and such, but it’s not as bad as an ad on a team uni.

    And please, don’t tell me about NASCAR pit teams and all that — from a rooting perspective, it’s still an individual sport.[/quote]

    I have to disagree. There are no stoppages in soccer like there are in most sports for commercials to run. If there were no stoppages in football, baseball, etc., those leagues would do the same thing.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 5:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23498″]

    The forum here is about ATHLETIC uniforms…and sometimes the conversation deviates a little bit – if that happens, not necessarily a horrible thing. I liken this place as going to a bar and talking sports while working – yes, 95% of the conversation is uni-related, but if that’s all anyone was allowed to talk about, this would get pretty boring pretty fast. I mean, unles you’re looking at the NFL rulebook, a person’s hair is not considered uniform, but I would never deny Minna her Polamalu fascination. So lighten up on the gulag stance of “ALL UNIFIORM ALL THE TIME” – it’s just not worth getting upset about![/quote]

    Banker B., just try to take my Polamalu away from me. You ain’t seen mad until you see me Polamalu-deprived. Besides, he looks good in the classic Steelers uni. He would look better out of it, but I take what I can get.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 5:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23501″]

    I’m trying – and have been working on it. I think there have been lots of good comments on uniforms recemtly, but this afternoon’s rant is ridiculous. Thanks Minna for being so nice.[/quote]

    Richard, I feel you. Sometimes, I’m looking for a particular post and my find engine freezes so I have to scroll through them one by one. It can get frustrating.

    I also resort to skimming. Today, for example, anything that had NASCAR in it, I skipped over because I have no interest. Oh, and it helps to read fast, too. I read about a hundred pages (of a novel) an hour, so I can go through posts pretty quickly.

    Lastly, just look for my name, Minna H. because I always stick to unis.

  • doug | November 17, 2006 at 5:48 pm |

    speaking of bad weather, have you ever hear of a football player almost drowning during a game?
    here’s the obit of a former steeler’s lineman.

  • JSwerdy | November 17, 2006 at 6:04 pm |

    check these out on reebok’s nfl team stores

    oldschool helmet hats

    they even have them in team colors, sometimes is painful to be a dolphins fan and have to bleed aqua and orange

  • Sean | November 17, 2006 at 8:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”23444″][quote comment=”23363″]Some perspective from someone who draws an occasional paycheck from an MLS club:

    [quote comment=”23350″]On behalf of all Salt Lakers and Utahns, I apologize that Real Salt Lake is breaking the ad-free trend on uniforms. They never got my business before and they definitely will not now.[/quote]

    Since we never had ya, we won’t miss ya.

    [quote comment=”23357″]Speaking of Real Salt Lake (and getting off topic a bit)…what the heck?!?

    OK, many MLS teams use original names, while others use names that are rips of other famous soccer clubs (Galaxy, Dynamo, etc.) The latter may be unoriginal, but what the heck, MLS needs all the help with name recognition it can get.

    Then we get to the team names that are more European in style. For example, FC Dallas – obvious rip of FC Barcelona – but “Football Club Dallas” at least makes sense absent the original context.

    DC United – obviously a rip on Man U, but since DC is the location of the capital of the UNITED States…OK.

    Red Bull New York & Chivas USA – crass commercialism, yes. Bizarre context, no.

    But Real Salt Lake? A rip of Real Madrid Club de Futbol (“Royal Madrid Football Club”)? What’s so royal about Salt Lake City? Absolutely absurd in context.[/quote]

    1 – We’re with you on Real Salt Lake. It makes no sense. It was a stupid name two years ago, it’s still stupid. It has no context or connection to anything Utahn. But the owner wanted to do it, so he did it. Case closed.

    2 – Exactly which “famous soccer club” is called the “Galaxy” that LA’s team is emulating?

    3 – As for FC Dallas being an “obvious rip on FC Barcelona” – WTF? As if Barca is the only “FC” in the world?

    4 – Ditto for DC United being an “obvious rip on ManU.” What are you smoking? Manchester United may be the best-known “United” in the world, but it’s far from the only. United is the single most traditional soccer team name there is, and DC’s braintrust has always wanted to do things in the most traditional way possible. As for the canard of “capital of the United States” that always seems to get brought up, it’s just that – a canard. It’s a traditional name for a traditional club and doesn’t have anything to do with it playing in the capital of the United States.

    5 – I’m with you on the other stuff. It is what it is, though.

    [quote comment=”23325″]Aside from the obvious issue with advertising on jerseys, I think it is a terrible decision for the MLS from a business perspective. The MLS is struggling to bring its product into the mainstream and get more “Casual” sports fans. I don’t see how making the jerseys different from the cultural norm will help with those tasks. If anything, it will give anti-soccer fans another reason to mock the sport.[/quote]

    1 – Actually, it’s a great decision from a business perspective. A million a year for a team that probably doesn’t have a $7 million annual budget is a big deal. It’s financial reality. Deal.

    2 – “Casual sports fans” have not ever, do not now, and are unlikely to ever embrace MLS, so we’re going to do what we need to do and, basically, to hell with them. We’re trying to get the people who are standing right outside the tent to come in first. Those down the street aren’t coming to begin with.

    3 – Advertising on the front of jerseys isn’t different from the “cultural norm” – the soccer cultural norm. That’s different from your American football culture, your basketball culture, your cricket culture, your hockey culture, and any other culture. I’ve seen the soccer culture. I was one of the thousands of Americans who spent their own dough to go to Germany for the World Cup, yet I was one of the few there who cares about MLS. The people who are soccer fans, who we’re really trying to get (and not the ever-elusive “casual sports fans”) aren’t going to be fazed by this at all.

    4 – As for “anti-soccer fans” needing another reason to ridicule the sport – bollocks. For eons, they’ve ranted about how soccer is boring and low-scoring and a wussy sport and foreign and yadda yadda yadda. they’re not going to stop, but we’ve long since stopped listening to them. We’re here to stay.[/quote]

    I’m not worthy, i’m not worth, i’m not worthy.
    Well Said, KT. Unfortunately we cannot respond to every yahoo that spouts off about Football, it’s an uphill struggle, i’m afraid.

    Well done.[/quote]

    Sorry this quote is so long, but there are two glaring mistakes in the MLS name discussions:

    1. Real Salt Lake chose that name in hopes of forming partnership with the Madrid club, which they did. RSL is a business partner, handling Madrid’s US licensing and merchandising issues. They also played each other on August 12, after a joint ceremony to celebrate the groundbreaking of RSL’s new stadium.

    2. Chivas USA is NOT, NOT, NOT an advertisement for scotch. Chivas is a Mexican side from Guadalahara that is used the MLS to for a sister-side that is closer to the Mexican population of Southern California. They have excellent unis.

    Now, what the real discussion should be is not whether or not the Real SL name is justified as a copycat, but whether or not it was a good strategy to gain partnership with one of the world’s most famous clubs.

  • matt | November 17, 2006 at 9:16 pm |

    [quote comment=”23480″]Dont know if its been brought up, but on the cover of the new SI Tyler Handsborough is wearing one of the new Nike jerseys and the jumpman logo is not visible because it has an American flag over it. The shorts do have the Jumpman logo.

    http://dynamic.si.cn...
    Authentic,s team- issued college jeresy DO NOT have logos on them. Only the game shorts have the manufacturer’s logo on them.
    Store bought jerseys DO have the logo on the jerseys. Therefore, Handsboroughs’ American flag is not covering up the Jumpman symbol.
    [quote comment=”23367″]I know we give Nike a hard time and all with the college bball jerseys (OSU, Fla., Kent., etc.) and we generally don’t give adidas a hard time, but I must say in my opinion the jerseys adidas has designed are awful. I mean, look at Louisville, Wisconsin and Memphis. Adidas is bad, the only jerseys they haven’t messed up is Indiana and UCLA, and they didn’t even design those jerseys! Am I wrong? Or is it just me?[/quote]
    Truer words have never been spoken. (Although I did make a post recently about this same thing)
    Adidas uniforms are terrible. There are even little differences in the Indiana uniform from when Nike made them, to now when Adidas makes them, that drive me crazy. The Adidas unis look like crap compared to the Nike ones.

  • Sean | November 17, 2006 at 9:22 pm |

    uni-centric addendum to my last post.

    real madrid and rsl share the same jersey design (an adidas creation we say a lot in the world cup), just in different color schemes:
    home kits: madrid rsl
    away kits: madrid rsl

    the chivas teams share a hell of a lot more, probably because they were designed as sister-teams:
    badges: guadalahara usa

    standard kits: guadalahara usa

    mascots: guadalahara usa

  • JSwerdy | November 17, 2006 at 9:37 pm |

    interesting description of the color purple as a favorite color on aol’s main page

    “Purple – This regal color is associated with regality and spirituality. It’s an ideal shade to wear when you’re seeking your life’s purpose. Avoid purple when you are having trouble putting your plans into action, because it inhibits practicality.

  • Teebz | November 17, 2006 at 10:05 pm |

    The Barney Rubble Hairpieces are wearing their alternate jerseys tonight versus the Penguins. They are currently leading the Penguins 3-1 midway through the third.

    If they didn’t have that number on their right shoulder, I’d own one right now.

  • Teebz | November 17, 2006 at 10:12 pm |

    Former NHL goalie Glenn Healy just made an interesting observation. Take a look at this goalie on the front of the arena.

    Click me!

    The goalie pads are on the wrong legs! Good Uni Watch catch by Healy! Do we have any other celebs who are as uni-observant?

  • Al | November 17, 2006 at 10:23 pm |

    [quote comment=”23475″]something that ive wondered for years…
    are the jets colors a direct reference to leon hess’ gas stations?[/quote]

    I believe the Jet’s green/white look pre-dates Leon Hess’ ownership. Wasn’t Sonny Werblin the one who splashed the cash for Joe Willie back in ’66?

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 17, 2006 at 10:25 pm |

    There is a deal on reebok.com as of right now. There is a friends and family promo. Check out reebok for anything; kicks, jerseys, hoodies, etc for 40% off. Get Christmas shopping done. The deal is till Sunday sometime. All you have to do is put in a promotional code of 598839 and you receive 40% off on all your purchases.

    i just tried the code and you will be able to find out your discount prior to final checkout.

    feel free to pass along.

  • DarkAudit | November 17, 2006 at 10:52 pm |

    [quote comment=”23531″][quote comment=”23475″]something that ive wondered for years…
    are the jets colors a direct reference to leon hess’ gas stations?[/quote]

    I believe the Jet’s green/white look pre-dates Leon Hess’ ownership. Wasn’t Sonny Werblin the one who splashed the cash for Joe Willie back in ’66?[/quote]
    According to Wikipedia, Werblin and Hess were both involved in the 1963 deal that turned the Titans into the Jets. The colors changed with the name change.

  • JSwerdy | November 17, 2006 at 11:49 pm |

    [quote comment=”23532″]There is a deal on reebok.com as of right now. There is a friends and family promo. Check out reebok for anything; kicks, jerseys, hoodies, etc for 40% off. Get Christmas shopping done. The deal is till Sunday sometime. All you have to do is put in a promotional code of 598839 and you receive 40% off on all your purchases.

    i just tried the code and you will be able to find out your discount prior to final checkout.

    feel free to pass along.[/quote]

    thanks i had been meaning to grab something off their site and was gonna wait a couple days, but that pretty much made the shipping free

    thanks for the code

  • Colin | November 18, 2006 at 1:07 am |

    My apologies if this has been mentioned already. I ran into this on another forum… the Portland Winter Hawks (WHL) wore special Veterans Day unis last Saturday.

    pic

    photobucket album

    Can’t say I’m too fond of them myself… other opinions?

    [Oh btw… those Seattle T-Birds alts posted a week or so back are really sweet, IMO.]

  • Colin | November 18, 2006 at 1:10 am |
  • Josh Huffines | November 18, 2006 at 3:26 am |

    Regarding Spencer Hawes and rooting for him:

    As a student of the University of Washington, I could not agree more. I dig the old-school uni he’s rockin’.

  • The Original Lee | November 18, 2006 at 5:49 am |

    [quote comment=”23499″]FWIW: I think NASCAR is absolutely a sport (although not one that I’m particularly interested in). But the issue of advertising on a soccer uni as opposed to advertising on NASCAR autos (or on boxing trunks, or bowling shirts…) is an apples/oranges comparison, because soccer is a team sport while NASCAR (and boxing, and bowling…) is not. A team is a brand, it’s what you root for, and the uniform transcends the identities of the people wearing it. That’s why advertising on team uniforms is offensive. But individual sports are different — I’d still rather not see ads on boxing trunks and such, but it’s not as bad as an ad on a team uni.

    And please, don’t tell me about NASCAR pit teams and all that — from a rooting perspective, it’s still an individual sport.[/quote]

    the team is a brand, but for soccer fans, the shirt sponsorship does not get in the way. ill use inter again because im an interista. but the pirelli logo is just a logo, actually i believe the own a part of the team as well but thats not the point. its a part of the jersey, but if you talk to any inter fan and ask them what represents their team the first thing they will say is nerazzurri (blue and black, the colors of the team). the shirt is even more respected in football than in basketball or baseball because it comes with a history. teams rarely change their first kit. it means so much more than a Cleveland cavs jersey that may change again in 10 years. the logo on the front may not be ideal, but it in no way takes away from the team as a brand, when done properly.

  • Kenn | November 18, 2006 at 9:52 am |

    [quote comment=”23463″]
    I’m disappointed to see so many people not only not minding, but actually defending advertising on soccer jerseys. This is a recent phenomenon and isn’t part of soccer tradition at all. [/quote]

    Two words: Bethlehem Steel. Look it up.

    English football actually had enacted a ban on such sponsorship in 1972, but small club Kettering Town claimed it was never written down and so struck a deal with local Kettering Tyres and wore shirts with the sponsor’s name on them in a game early in 1976 before the FA told them to stop.

    In 1977, the FA relented and allowed shirt sponsorship. When top-flight teams first started doing it, they wouldn’t allow teams to wear sponsored jerseys on TV games (kind of defeating the purpose, IMHO) and eventually relented on that, too. Now it’s ubiquitous.

    BTW, the whole Chivas/Chivas USA thing shows an amazing lack of understanding of the “soccer culture” that I was talking about above and why it’s different from yours. Non-soccer people think “shi-vuss,” when anyone in the soccer culture knows right away what “Chee-vuss” is – Club Deportivo de Guadalajara, nicknamed “Chivas” for “goats” (because long ago a sportswriter noted that the Guadalajara team ran around like crazy goats and the nickname stuck). The MLS team is owned by the owner of the Mexican League team and its official name is Club Deportivo Chivas USA or CD Chivas USA.

    BTW, Chivas Regal is (or was, anyway, don’t know if they still are) a sponsor of Chivas USA. Recognizing an opportunity when they see it.

  • Robert | November 18, 2006 at 11:32 am |

    The “Is [NASCAR, golf, whatever] a sport” debate became seriously tiresome after the hundred times that I heard it from friends, radio talk show hosts and so forth. What is the fascination with such a mundane topic?

  • Matthew S. | November 18, 2006 at 9:23 pm |

    [quote comment=”23552″][quote comment=”23463″]
    I’m disappointed to see so many people not only not minding, but actually defending advertising on soccer jerseys. This is a recent phenomenon and isn’t part of soccer tradition at all. [/quote]

    Two words: Bethlehem Steel. Look it up.

    English football actually had enacted a ban on such sponsorship in 1972, but small club Kettering Town claimed it was never written down and so struck a deal with local Kettering Tyres and wore shirts with the sponsor’s name on them in a game early in 1976 before the FA told them to stop.

    In 1977, the FA relented and allowed shirt sponsorship. When top-flight teams first started doing it, they wouldn’t allow teams to wear sponsored jerseys on TV games (kind of defeating the purpose, IMHO) and eventually relented on that, too. Now it’s ubiquitous.

    BTW, the whole Chivas/Chivas USA thing shows an amazing lack of understanding of the “soccer culture” that I was talking about above and why it’s different from yours. Non-soccer people think “shi-vuss,” when anyone in the soccer culture knows right away what “Chee-vuss” is – Club Deportivo de Guadalajara, nicknamed “Chivas” for “goats” (because long ago a sportswriter noted that the Guadalajara team ran around like crazy goats and the nickname stuck). The MLS team is owned by the owner of the Mexican League team and its official name is Club Deportivo Chivas USA or CD Chivas USA.

    BTW, Chivas Regal is (or was, anyway, don’t know if they still are) a sponsor of Chivas USA. Recognizing an opportunity when they see it.[/quote]

    I take back my ignorant comment regarding Chivas USA then. I had no idea they were named after a Mexican team. There’s my mea culpa regarding the name. I did however know that the MLS team was, at one time, sponsored by Chivas Regal (which is good scotch fyi).