This real money site caters to all players, with reviews on mobile games you can play, including slots, blackjack, and roulette.

Coming Soon: The Bronze Jockstrap

pants.jpg

Bonus ESPN column today — here’s the link.

Meanwhile: There are lots of trophies with equipment-based imagery (like the Gold Glove and Silver Slugger awards), and several more featuring balls (like the Lombardi, O’Brien, and Commissioner’s Trophies). But you don’t often see uniform-based awards. Yeah, there’s the Green Jacket and the yellow jersey, but those are actual items of apparel, not depictions of apparel. If there’s a Golden Cap or Platinum Jersey award floating around out there, I’m not aware of it.

There’s a uni-based award in college football, however, and it’s up for grabs this weekend in Columbus. In keeping with longstanding tradition, if Ohio State beats Michigan, all OSU players will instantly become members of the Gold Pants Club (which sounds like a support group for the bladder-challenged) and receive a little charm pendant to mark the occasion. This is, to my knowledge, the sports world’s only pants-based honor.

According to this page, the Gold Pants ritual dates back to the 1930s, when OSU coach Francis Schmidt was asked about facing Michigan and replied, “They put their pants on one leg at a time, same as everybody else.” Seventy years later, the little pants charms have become a strong OSU tradition. Somewhat predictably, they’ve also turned into a merchandising bonanza, with lots of spin-off products like this — a symbol of a symbol.

Every now and then, a real Gold Pants charm shows up on eBay. This one, from 1955, sold just a few days ago — for nearly a grand. Two others went up for sale in late 2003, which caused a bit of a stir among serious OSU fans.

Of course, no matter what happens on Saturday, the year’s most famous gold pants are likely to be the ones recently worn — just barely — by Antonio Bryant. Too bad he went to Pitt, not Ohio State.

100_1861.JPG

Collar Controversy, Continued: This thing with the Saints and their undershirt collars keeps getting weirder. Here’s the deal: On Monday several readers told me that Charles Grant had worn a dress shirt — or at least something with what appeared to have a dress shirt collar — under his shoulder pads. So on Tuesday I asked if anyone could get any screen grabs, and that night reader Chad Morris provided me with several shots, which I posted yesterday.

But as several readers quickly pointed out, the pics didn’t show Charles Grant (who wears No. 94) — they were of Will Smith (No. 91). Apparently Morris, while fast-forwarding through his DVR file of the game in search of screen shots, had inadvertently found a second collar-clad Saints player. I asked if he’d be willing to go back and look for shots of Grant, and he graciously agreed. You can see the successful results of his search here, here, and here. You can even see Grant and Smith standing together — perhaps trading collar tips — here and here.

So now we have two confirmed cases of collared Saints players. As the saying goes, two’s a coincidence, three’s a trend. Stay tuned.

Radio Free Uni Watch: I’ll be appearing on the KADI’s “Morning Drive Sports Report” show (1340AM, from Springfield, Missouri) on Friday morning at 9 a.m. Eastern Time. I’m told that the spot will run at least 15 minutes, and you can stream it here.

Uni Watch News Ticker: You know uni watchery has gone mainstream when there’s an entire article devoted to the Jazz switching the color of their road shoes. … Yesterday’s discussion of pointed collars prompted a sharp rebuke from soccer fans, who chided me for overlooking all the the game’s long history of collared jerseys. Longtime contributor Doug Brei provided the best pics, pointing me toward this, this, this, this, and this. … Interesting note from Mark Meeks, who notes: “I’m hearing rumors from some folks with better seats than I had that Panthers RB DeAngelo Williams was wearing cleats with lights on them (like the kind little kids wear). I can’t imagine a player wearing something like that, especially a rookie backup, but they insist it’s true.” Anybody know anything more about this? … Remember that British football league I mentioned yesterday? Joe Moore poked around their web site and discovered that at least one team is wearing recycled NCAA jerseys, and you can see here and here. … If you’re curious about the University of Oregon’s identity program (i.e., the guidelines for how the school’s logo and seal are supposed to be applied to letterhead, typographic style rules, etc.), an admirably detailed style guide is available in this PDF file. “If only they applied the same theories and principles to their unis,” says Joe Hilseberg, who provided the link (and who also pointed out this article about NFL uni numbers).

 

202 comments to Coming Soon: The Bronze Jockstrap

  • Stu | November 16, 2006 at 8:15 am |

    Mornin’ Anybody know the league’s rationale behind letting Mike Nolan and Jack Del Rio only wear suits for 2 games this season?

    Let’s hope they both go with the black cleats/white sock look that Lombardi made famous.

  • Mike from Queens | November 16, 2006 at 8:28 am |

    I’m thinking another “award” that has apparel on it could be the baseball Hall of Fame plaques. Much ado is made of what team goes on the caps, and it is their official commemoration. That’s the first thing that comes to mind, and I don’t know if it will be the last. Definitely the most prominent.

  • Trey | November 16, 2006 at 8:36 am |

    I was at the Panthers-Bucs game on Monday night, and whenever Deangelo Williams got tackled and we could see the bottom of his cleats, it certainly looked like they were lit up. While he was running, it looked normal, but the bottom of his cleats were definitely a very brilliant, electric blue.

  • Mike from Queens | November 16, 2006 at 8:37 am |

    And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve? Are we outfitting mice and teaching them to put their pants on one leg at a time like us humans? Or, is it for when they look down at their feet to put on their shoes, so that they know which foot is which?

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 8:40 am |

    Soccer’s also got the Golden Boot and Golden Ball at the World Cup.

    I love Chris McAlister’s quote in that story: “It doesn’t mean anything because it’s not the number I want,” said McAlister, who would trade his No. 21 jersey for the No. 11 jersey he wore at Arizona. “It’s the number I’m stuck with because the NFL is the ‘No Fun League’ and wants everybody to be in certain numbers. Who cares?”

    Hear, hear. I’m surprised those Saints haven’t been fined for having collars yet.

  • Paul Lukas | November 16, 2006 at 8:41 am |

    [quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.

  • Stu | November 16, 2006 at 8:44 am |

    I think the winner of the annual LSU-Arkansas tilt gets a trophy called ‘The Boot’, but its shaped like Louisiana and Arkansas stuck together.

  • Marc M. | November 16, 2006 at 8:49 am |

    [quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    Funny nonetheless.

  • Don | November 16, 2006 at 8:52 am |

    [quote comment=”23072″]I think the winner of the annual LSU-Arkansas tilt gets a trophy called ‘The Boot’, but its shaped like Louisiana and Arkansas stuck together.[/quote]

    That is correct, and it weighs 175 lbs.

    http://www.answers.c...

  • Stu | November 16, 2006 at 8:54 am |

    [quote comment=”23075″][quote comment=”23072″]I think the winner of the annual LSU-Arkansas tilt gets a trophy called ‘The Boot’, but its shaped like Louisiana and Arkansas stuck together.[/quote]

    That is correct, and it weighs 175 lbs.

    http://www.answers.c...

  • Chris Hilf | November 16, 2006 at 8:59 am |

    No one has mentioned ‘the card‘, or did I miss it?

  • Mike from Queens | November 16, 2006 at 9:08 am |

    [quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    That is a fantastic coincidence. Mind if I ask why you think that? (Other than the fact that it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.)

  • mark | November 16, 2006 at 9:16 am |

    I think R & L DOES signify right and left – remember, the story said it came from “put one leg on at a time” right then left (ore vise versa). could be wrong, but it makes sense to me.

  • Brandon Vogel | November 16, 2006 at 9:20 am |

    Why don’t victorious Wolverines now get little silver sweater vest charms? Seems like a no-brainer.

  • Miguel | November 16, 2006 at 9:22 am |

    [quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve? [/quote]

    The earliest logo creep ever – the pendant is sponsored by Ralph Lauren.

  • Kevin | November 16, 2006 at 9:28 am |

    [quote comment=”23065″]Mornin’ Anybody know the league’s rationale behind letting Mike Nolan and Jack Del Rio only wear suits for 2 games this season?

    Let’s hope they both go with the black cleats/white sock look that Lombardi made famous.[/quote]

    Mike Nolan had requested through the league to wear a suit every game this year but the league turned him down, something to do with NFL licensed apparel. Nolan wanted to do it to honor his father if I remember correctly. As for Del Rio wearing a suit I have no idea why.

  • Michael Churchill | November 16, 2006 at 9:28 am |

    re. the recycling of jerseys in British (American) Football.

    You have to remember that unlike the big bucks in football in the US, the BAFL is amateur. Sponsorship and corporate logos on unis is a fact of survival.

    Despite the withdrawals by the NFL of the London Monarchs and the Scottish Claymores there is still a hardcore following for football in the UK.

    Currently many British fans are keenly following a man who played in the BAFL for the Leicester Panthers in 1988 – candidate for Coach of the Year Sean Payton of the New Orleans Saints.

    PS. If you hadn’t realised… The Dominos Oxford Saints? Yes, sponsored by the pizza people.

  • David | November 16, 2006 at 9:30 am |

    [quote comment=”23079″][quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    That is a fantastic coincidence. Mind if I ask why you think that? (Other than the fact that it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.)[/quote]

    Read the “caused quite a stir” article linked by Paul.

  • Pat | November 16, 2006 at 9:30 am |

    [quote comment=”23078″]No one has mentioned ‘the card‘, or did I miss it?[/quote]

    That is fantastic.

    By the way, random question. I was looking through a book called “The Celtics in Black and White” last night and noticed in the first few pictures that the Celtics were dressed in white uniforms with white numbers and what appeared to be a green drop shadow for the numbers. I couldn’t tell the color for sure because, as you may have figured out already, the pictures were all in black and white. The letters for “Celtics” above the numbers were still green though. I had never seen this before and couldn’t find any pictures this morning. Anybody else ever seen these old Celts uniforms? I’m talking old too, like before Bob Cousy was ever on the team.

  • Ryne | November 16, 2006 at 9:40 am |

    I posted this last night also but it was late…

    I am at a college and we are looking to purchase new decals and bills for our batting helmets. Anyone know of a place online…

    Thanks for all your help!

  • Kyle Joecken | November 16, 2006 at 9:45 am |

    Am I crazy, or does the quarterback in this picture have “1 1/2” scribbled on his head? And if I’m correct, any idea why?

    recycled unis

  • Paul Lukas | November 16, 2006 at 9:50 am |

    [quote comment=”23079″][quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    That is a fantastic coincidence. Mind if I ask why you think that? (Other than the fact that it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.)[/quote]

    Because it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.

    Actually, this article, which is linked in the main blog text, refers to the charms having initials.

  • Richard | November 16, 2006 at 9:52 am |

    [quote comment=”23090″]Am I crazy, or does the quarterback in this picture have “1 1/2” scribbled on his head? And if I’m correct, any idea why?

    recycled unis[/quote]

    Looks like the helmet has been dinged up, and those are the markings. It’s not meant to be a 1 1/2, but rather scrape marks.

  • Nick | November 16, 2006 at 9:53 am |

    The ‘R, L’ thing is easy to explain.

    It’s for Ohio State players…they need the directions.

  • Justin | November 16, 2006 at 9:53 am |

    Sidestriping gone wrong at UC-San Diego (in blue).

  • MetsFan AZ | November 16, 2006 at 9:54 am |

    [quote comment=”23087″][quote comment=”23079″][quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    That is a fantastic coincidence. Mind if I ask why you think that? (Other than the fact that it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.)[/quote]

    Read the “caused quite a stir” article linked by Paul.[/quote]
    Apparently lawyer’s fees are mounting for Mr. Clarett.

  • Chris | November 16, 2006 at 9:55 am |

    DeAngelo was wearing the blinky lights in pre-game but not during. If I am not mistaken they are the blinky lights are sold by Memphis – which would mean they were blue and they are inside our logo.

    As far as the bottom of his cleats, they are blue as a shout out to the University of Memphis.

  • Joe O | November 16, 2006 at 9:58 am |

    [quote comment=”23094″]Sidestriping gone wrong at UC-San Diego (in blue).[/quote]

    What in the world are they thinking? Is there any possible explanation for what that is supposed to look like!?!?

  • al | November 16, 2006 at 9:59 am |

    Hmmm… things that only occur to me:

    If the BAFL were to incorporate the tradition of the pendant ‘pants’, it might be taken in a different light, no? Seeing as the British ‘bird’ consists of two digits, not the middle digit.

  • bj | November 16, 2006 at 10:00 am |

    The link to the charm being sold had the inititals MC (Maurice Clarett, it seemed to imply) on it. I’d say they’re personalized.

    And the marks on the QB’s helmet are just scuffs. Another mark of amatuer football is the lack of funds to repaint helmets.

  • al | November 16, 2006 at 10:07 am |

    [quote comment=”23095″][quote comment=”23087″][quote comment=”23079″][quote comment=”23071″][quote comment=”23069″]And I especially like the R and L on the legs of that Gold Pants Club thingy. What the hell kind of purpose could that possibly serve?[/quote]

    I think those are the recipient’s initials.[/quote]

    That is a fantastic coincidence. Mind if I ask why you think that? (Other than the fact that it would be a totally inane thing to put left/right there.)[/quote]

    Read the “caused quite a stir” article linked by Paul.[/quote]
    Apparently lawyer’s fees are mounting for Mr. Clarett.[/quote]
    either that, or Maurice just added to his gun collection.

  • Steve | November 16, 2006 at 10:16 am |

    This BAFL stuff is fascinating. Someone at ESPN needs to get on this story. Probably the best reality TV source material since ANTM. I’m picturing Two-A-Days meets Monty Python, and loving it. That’s what all brits are like, right?

  • Capt D Kerk | November 16, 2006 at 10:20 am |

    Not that it is a long standing tradition, but starting with the 2003-04 season, the Calgary Flames of the NHL have awarded a different article of clothing for the hardest working player in every victory that he must wear during post game interviews. In 2003-04, it was a Green Hardhat, in 2005-06, it was a Gold Hardhat, and this year it is a gawdy tie. This tradition was started by Craig Conroy, and continued after he left the team for LA.

    I see the Edmonton Oilers also have a similar ritual and it involves a hideous leather and fur coat that they must wear to the airport.

  • Cork | November 16, 2006 at 10:20 am |

    Colorado State and Wyoming play each year for the “Bronze Boot“. I have a feeling that Boot trophies are quite common in football. The in-city rivalry in Iowa City, IA also plays each year for “The Boot”. Sorry no pics of that one, but i do believe that game is this weekend.

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 10:23 am |

    This is not necessarily a uni-related comment, but it fits in connection with the “gold pants” thread. What on earth is the deal with Ohio State not wanting to acknowledge the second word in their name? (Third if you count their inane insistence of referring to “The” Ohio State University.) Two of their most cherished traditions — “script Ohio” and the gold pants — omit “State” altogether.

    Honestly, this only bugs me because I’m a Michigan fan and am inclined to be bugged by dumb things that Ohio State does. (e.g. “Hang on Sloopy.”) But if I were an alum of Ohio University, I would be genuinely pissed by it. Any Ohio State grads/fans want to explain their eagerness to masquerade as the university in Athens rather than the university in Columbus?

  • DJL | November 16, 2006 at 10:26 am |

    Article describing the colors and decision making process on the new Boise Hawks logo. The aricle is more interesting than I expected.

    Some snippets:

    “Unlike the Hawks’ former logo (a standard baseball with blue trim and a nostalgic script of the letter B), their new identity will primarily consist of the color green, Rahr said. He describes the color as a “City-of-Trees green.”

    “The other colors that will make up the Hawks’ new look are what Rahr termed ‘downtown red, sunshine orange, and corn silk yellow.'”

  • DenverGregg | November 16, 2006 at 10:29 am |

    There’s the Bronze Boot trophy that goes to the winner of Wyoming-Colorado State each year. It is an Army boot, though, rather than a sports uniform.

  • DJL | November 16, 2006 at 10:33 am |

    Not sure if this was mentioned, but according to the Myrtle Beach Sun, the Myrtle Beach Pelicans minor league baseball club is unveiling their new logo brick by brick.

    Via the Sun:

    “The Atlanta Braves Class A affiliate announced Wednesday that it will unveil its freshened-up look via its Web site and a wall that will lose its bricks gradually over the coming weeks.”

    According to the article, the new logo will also facilitate new uniforms for the team.

  • Andy | November 16, 2006 at 10:34 am |

    But you don’t often see uniform-based awards. Yeah, there’s the Green Jacket and the yellow jersey, but those are actual items of apparel, not depictions of apparel.
    Don’t forget the boxing belt.
    Yes, it’s technically an item of apparel, but I’d like to see the pants with belt loops wide enough to fit that belt through them.

  • joe | November 16, 2006 at 10:36 am |

    Logo for a German peewee football (American) team. Interesting, I think the NFL would have a hard time figuring out which team would be allowed to sue.

  • Kelli | November 16, 2006 at 10:38 am |

    Presbyterian College and Newberry College each year play for the Bronze Derby. The story of its origin is entertaining.

    I am inclined to believe that the R-L on the gold pants is to aid the Ohio State players in dressing themselves properly. Reality is really unimportant here.

    Go Wolverines!

  • Kenny | November 16, 2006 at 10:41 am |

    AAAAAH!!! Stop showing that damn picture of Antonio Bryant. Oh and that card of Leon Washington is amazing!

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 10:44 am |

    Also, the William M. Jennings Trophy in the NHL has little goalie sticks on it.

    And, as Paul often writes, merit decals on football helmets are a very uni-centric award, not to mention Nebraska’s Blackshirts, although I can’t find any pictures of anyone wearing one.

  • Kenny | November 16, 2006 at 10:45 am |

    [quote comment=”23105″]This is not necessarily a uni-related comment, but it fits in connection with the “gold pants” thread. What on earth is the deal with Ohio State not wanting to acknowledge the second word in their name? (Third if you count their inane insistence of referring to “The” Ohio State University.) Two of their most cherished traditions — “script Ohio” and the gold pants — omit “State” altogether.

    Honestly, this only bugs me because I’m a Michigan fan and am inclined to be bugged by dumb things that Ohio State does. (e.g. “Hang on Sloopy.”) But if I were an alum of Ohio University, I would be genuinely pissed by it. Any Ohio State grads/fans want to explain their eagerness to masquerade as the university in Athens rather than the university in Columbus?[/quote]

    I was just going to post on this. The gold pants at the top of the page say Ohio 20 Mich 9. That looked a little weird to me and seems a little weird that they would put Ohio, not OSU or Ohio St. on there

  • Kris | November 16, 2006 at 10:53 am |

    Coaches test driving Reebok suits:
    http://sports.espn.g...

    It will be interesting to see what, if any, logo creep there will be on the suit. I just can’t see how there won’t be a reebok logo on the suit jacket.

  • Brian in Milwaukee | November 16, 2006 at 11:08 am |

    Great article here on an un-retired, then re-retired number at Marquette.

  • mark | November 16, 2006 at 11:09 am |

    my guess is the logo will just be a lapel pin or something. I cant imagine it will be TOO dramatic (I hope)

  • bradley | November 16, 2006 at 11:10 am |

    did anyone see the baylor/gonzaga game last night on espn 2? baylor has to have the worst uniforms in college basketball. even worse they are wearing black when black is not even one of their colors. their colors are green and gold and they all of a sudden are wearing black. i don’t have a pic, but man are they bad.

  • Brian in Milwaukee | November 16, 2006 at 11:10 am |

    The preview showed it: MU

  • Dan | November 16, 2006 at 11:11 am |

    [quote comment=”23068″]I was at the Panthers-Bucs game on Monday night, and whenever Deangelo Williams got tackled and we could see the bottom of his cleats, it certainly looked like they were lit up. While he was running, it looked normal, but the bottom of his cleats were definitely a very brilliant, electric blue.[/quote]

    I was sitting in the end zone and saw the lights. Our entire section got a kick out of it. The lights appeared to be in the bottom of the soles of his shoes. Very Cool. We could see the lights when he ran.

  • BtotheE | November 16, 2006 at 11:15 am |

    [quote comment=”23078″]No one has mentioned ‘the card‘, or did I miss it?[/quote]
    I love seeing a Florida boy showing love to his home town of Jacksonvile, (EAST SIDE) IS what the sign he is making. (East Jacksonville)

  • DenverGregg | November 16, 2006 at 11:20 am |

    Maybe the pants charms omit “state” to keep the second ‘O’ in Ohio in its precarious spot.

    Uh oh, this is starting to get a bit Deadspin-ish.

  • al | November 16, 2006 at 11:21 am |

    [quote comment=”23109″]Not sure if this was mentioned, but according to the Myrtle Beach Sun, the Myrtle Beach Pelicans minor league baseball club is unveiling their new logo brick by brick.

    Via the Sun:

    “The Atlanta Braves Class A affiliate announced Wednesday that it will unveil its freshened-up look via its Web site and a wall that will lose its bricks gradually over the coming weeks.”

    According to the article, the new logo will also facilitate new uniforms for the team.[/quote]

    As new logos go … this one is better than average. The feisty pelican looks a hell of alot better than that dopey, run of the mill Boise Hawk.

  • Bob in Hopewell | November 16, 2006 at 11:21 am |

    [quote comment=”23112″]Logo for a German peewee football (American) team. Interesting, I think the NFL would have a hard time figuring out which team would be allowed to sue.[/quote]

    the Tex-Red-skin-noles?

  • Smail | November 16, 2006 at 11:26 am |

    Regarding the gold pants questions: The letters on the front are the recipient’s initials, and the reason it says Ohio is, obviously, a matter of tradition. Why did the first one just say “Ohio”? Probably because Ohio State, or Ohio St. would have been too small to read. Remember that these things aren’t much bigger than your fingernail! On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name instead of an acronym?

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 11:31 am |

    [quote comment=”23093″]The ‘R, L’ thing is easy to explain.

    It’s for Ohio State players…they need the directions.[/quote]

    They put it on their shoes too.

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 11:32 am |

    >On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?

  • Jim H | November 16, 2006 at 11:35 am |

    They put their pants on one leg at a time, just like Bruce Dickinson, but once his pants are on, he makes gold records, not gold pants.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 11:36 am |

    [quote comment=”23130″]Regarding the gold pants questions: The letters on the front are the recipient’s initials, and the reason it says Ohio is, obviously, a matter of tradition. Why did the first one just say “Ohio”? Probably because Ohio State, or Ohio St. would have been too small to read. Remember that these things aren’t much bigger than your fingernail! On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name instead of an acronym?[/quote]

    For whatever inane reason, the folks at Ohio State have the most obnoxious complex about being referred to THE OHIO state University. I can’t imagine why a University as large as OSU with a successful football program would be so insecure as it relates to the University of Ohio, but it is what it is. The fact that it says Ohio, not Ohio State is intentional, see script Ohio, and their cheer being O-H–I-O.

  • kris | November 16, 2006 at 11:37 am |

    I’m having a hard time finding an article to confirm it online, but I remember in the early 1990’s Karl Malone wore those silly “L.A. Lights” shoes that would light up on every step. L.A. Gear agreed to pay the fine, but he eventually stopped wearing them.

  • Sean | November 16, 2006 at 11:39 am |

    [quote comment=”23081″]Why don’t victorious Wolverines now get little silver sweater vest charms? Seems like a no-brainer.[/quote]

    probably because that state up north can’t beat tressel! why would you celebrate a 1-4 record?!?! go bucks!

    btw – in case anyone missed it, osu-mich game this saturday. probably on tv

  • DJL | November 16, 2006 at 11:43 am |

    Can we please keep this about uniforms and not OSU vs. UM?

    I am sure this has been linked to a number of message boards on both sides by now, and we’d like to keep the discussion on topic.

    We don’t need a repeat of the Ron Santo incident.

  • Steve Prudente | November 16, 2006 at 11:44 am |

    Did anyone notice in the Oregon PDF that one of the fonts they use is called “Akzidenz Grotesk?” I assume if translated this would mean “grotesque accident,” which would be an accurate description of their uniforms. Ironic, no?

  • Broker75 | November 16, 2006 at 11:45 am |

    [quote comment=”23008″][quote comment=”23005″]MetsFan:
    you getting season’s tickets for the new stadium?[/quote]
    Being that I live in Tucson, no. I make it to Phoenix to see them play the D-Backs and road trip to LA and SD. But i will make every effort to make it out for opening day ’09. How about you?[/quote]

    Well, I’m a Yankees fan, so…hmmm.
    Would love to see Yankees vs Mets at the new Yankee Stadium.
    Season’s tickets? ha! I don’t have the income that Donald Trump or Regis take in, so probably not season’s.

  • Pat | November 16, 2006 at 11:47 am |

    [quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.

  • Broker75 | November 16, 2006 at 11:52 am |

    Not really “uni” talk, but it made my day.
    Not too many people support this guy.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 12:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.

  • Andy | November 16, 2006 at 12:03 pm |

    [quote comment=”23144″]Not really “uni” talk, but it made my day.
    Not too many people support this guy.[/quote]
    Yes, please stick to “uni” related posts please.

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 12:10 pm |

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.

    As far as I’m concerned, the fewer members the OSU band has, the better. However, despite my Michigan loyalties, I would be genuinely impressed if, after doing a script Ohio and dotting the i, the OSU band then marched into a script “State.” (I think they could do this without too much of a personnel increase in The Most Overrated Band in the Land.) Instead, the fact that they don’t says a lot about the institution’s de-emphasis of the word “State” in their name.

    If it truly doesn’t matter whether Ohio State refers to itself as Ohio State or Ohio, then maybe the basketball teams, for example, should just take the word “State” off their uniforms. (I felt it necessary to bring this thread back to a uniform-related discussion.)

    And whether or not there are offended Ohio U. Bobcats is really beside the point. The fact is that some sixty-plus years before Ohio State was founded, there was already an institution named “Ohio.” The fact that Ohio State occasionally refers to itself as “Ohio” is at best confusing and at worst shows a bit of institutional insecurity, as another poster mentioned.

  • Pat | November 16, 2006 at 12:14 pm |

    [quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”

  • Phil Pereira | November 16, 2006 at 12:28 pm |

    I figure I’d mention that in soccer, top scorers earn an award called the golden boot (I think there may be a silver one too and maybe a bronze, I’m not sure). Makes sense since they use their shoes to score (mainly, since headers are allowed of course).

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 12:30 pm |

    [quote comment=”23149″][quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”[/quote]

    Umm…. the title “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is the universities actual title. No, I don’t like them referring to themselves as Ohio, but to say that it is just being cocky by saying “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is wrong. That phrase is the name of the school just like Michigan is “University of Michigan.”

  • Andy | November 16, 2006 at 12:36 pm |

    This is uniform related. It’s about soccer though (yawn).

  • OCWill | November 16, 2006 at 12:38 pm |

    the university of california, berkeley’s (“Cal”) marching band spells out ‘California’ in script from endzone to endzone, which i find quite impressive.

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 12:40 pm |

    the university of california, berkeley’s (”Cal”) marching band spells out ‘California’ in script from endzone to endzone, which i find quite impressive.

    Do they have sousaphone players dot both i’s? Because that would be a nice bit of one-upmanship to Ohio State.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 12:42 pm |

    [quote comment=”23149″][quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”[/quote]

    The omission of State is part and parcel of the THE Ohio State University quandary. It is two parts of the same “cocky gesture” indicating that Ohio State is “the [only] school that matters”.
    For the record I think it is also lame and arrogant when alumni of the Miami (Florida) football program refer to themselves as “the U”. I think that the “THE” thing is the same type of gesture, but I think it’s really lame because of who is it is directed at. Seriously, Ohio Univ.? Akron? Bowling Green (State University, for the record)? Cincinnati? What’s the deal? Which Ohio state university are they afraid they are being confused with? Do they really need to emphasize that they are better than these teams? Or does it just make them look cocky, like somebody from the U.

  • Banker Bill | November 16, 2006 at 12:44 pm |

    [quote comment=”23131″][quote comment=”23093″]The ‘R, L’ thing is easy to explain.

    It’s for Ohio State players…they need the directions.[/quote]

    They put it on their shoes too.[/quote]

    Not saying anything about EITHER university directly, but there’s an old joke about putting TGIF on your shoes if you’re not overly intelligent…for “Toes Go In First”

  • Chris Mewett | November 16, 2006 at 12:45 pm |

    On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?

  • al | November 16, 2006 at 12:47 pm |

    [quote comment=”23152″]

    This is uniform related. It’s about soccer though (yawn).[/quote]
    yeah, soccer, yawn… maybe you’d rather make a contribution to all the this stupid Ohio State/Michigan crap we’ll been reading about here for two weeks.
    Or why don’t you just get the ball rolling on another truly exhilarating exchange on our tattoos !
    Prat.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 12:51 pm |

    [quote comment=”23159″]On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?[/quote]

    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.

    2] Many people would dispute Ohio State’s academic reputation. I’m not here, I’m just saying many people would. I’m sure a Michigan fan will jump in for me here.

    3] As Texas Aggie (which do you prefer Texas Aggies or Texas A&M) I would think that you would be more sympathetic to my point of view, what with the Univeristy of Texas running around. At least they don’t refer to themselves as THE University of Texas.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 12:54 pm |

    4] How would you feel if UT made the claim to represent the ENTIRE state of Texas? I think that there might actually be blood shead over that.

  • Jonathon | November 16, 2006 at 12:56 pm |

    Do you think that allowing Del Rio and Nolan wear suits signals that Reebok (er, Adidas) and the NFL have finally decided to conquer the last area of clothing they don’t have a stake in – business attire?

    Think about it. Lapel pins of your favorite team. Striped or logo-patterned ties to wear to the office to support your team. Sportcoats with a team patch. Sweaters and sweater-vests with the team logo, all perfect for supporting your NFL team in the work week leading up to the big game.

    They’ve already got the weekend-wear covered – polos, sweatshirts, tshirts, jackets. They’ve got the jerseys and hats, too. For teams with traditional color schemes (Bears, Niners, Cowboys, Patriots, Steelers, Browns, Redskins, Colts, Chiefs, Broncos, etc.), a striped tie with the team colors and a small Reebok logo at the bottom would sell like hotcakes for $35-45 a pop. It’s the perfect way for the white collar crowd to support the team Monday thru Friday.

  • Robert | November 16, 2006 at 12:56 pm |

    “Dollar” Bill Byrne is messing with tradition in order generate more money? Now there’s a shocker. I was quite pleased when he left Nebraska to go to A&M.

    I will never forgive him for removing the stripes from the football pants after the 1994 National Championship season, and instituting the wearing of shiny stripe-free pants that looked hideous. It took a new A.D. to bring back the traditional pants.

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 12:58 pm |

    [quote comment=”23161″][quote comment=”23159″]On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?[/quote]

    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.

    2] Many people would dispute Ohio State’s academic reputation. I’m not here, I’m just saying many people would. I’m sure a Michigan fan will jump in for me here.

    3] As Texas Aggie (which do you prefer Texas Aggies or Texas A&M) I would think that you would be more sympathetic to my point of view, what with the Univeristy of Texas running around. At least they don’t refer to themselves as THE University of Texas.[/quote]

    One difference is that “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is the university’s name. It’s not Ohio State University. Gosh, when will you people understand. THINK!! It’s not that hard.

  • Pat | November 16, 2006 at 12:59 pm |

    [quote comment=”23157″][quote comment=”23149″][quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”[/quote]

    The omission of State is part and parcel of the THE Ohio State University quandary. It is two parts of the same “cocky gesture” indicating that Ohio State is “the [only] school that matters”.
    For the record I think it is also lame and arrogant when alumni of the Miami (Florida) football program refer to themselves as “the U”. I think that the “THE” thing is the same type of gesture, but I think it’s really lame because of who is it is directed at. Seriously, Ohio Univ.? Akron? Bowling Green (State University, for the record)? Cincinnati? What’s the deal? Which Ohio state university are they afraid they are being confused with? Do they really need to emphasize that they are better than these teams?

    Or does it just make them look cocky, like somebody from the U.[/quote]

    Well, if this is all to be more like “The U” then I am against everything and anything that Ohio does that anybody has ever been offended by. Anybody that wants to be more like “The U” needs to have their head checked.

  • Kevin | November 16, 2006 at 1:09 pm |

    I read an interesting comment yesterday (I forget where) regarding NFL players saying where they went to school during introductions. The person said they thought the player shouldn’t be allowed to say “The Ohio State University” or “University of Michigan” if they had not graduated from that school.

    The person equated it with putting a school on a resume’, and that surely anyone who did that, but did not graduate from the school would face criticism or worse. He suggested that only the highest level of school completed be announced on TV. I had never thought about it before, but it does make sense.

  • Kramer | November 16, 2006 at 1:11 pm |

    [quote comment=”23161″]
    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.quote]

    Cincy is in the Big EAST
    a true football powerhouse conference.

    GO RUTGERS(btw I actually like their red on red look)

  • Chris Mewett | November 16, 2006 at 1:12 pm |

    [quote comment=”23152″]

    This is uniform related. It’s about soccer though (yawn).[/quote]That link gives a far-from-comprehensive list of some teams with alcohol sponsorships on their shirts. Here are some images.

    Celtic (Scotland) — Carling
    Rangers (Scotland) — Carling
    Liverpool (England) — Carlsberg
    Everton (England) — Chang
    Wisla Krakow (Poland) — Tyskie
    Arminia Bielefeld (Germany) — Krombacher [Interestingly, this photo shows the players safety-pinning the back of their shirts prior to posing for pictures]

  • Robert | November 16, 2006 at 1:13 pm |

    [quote comment=”23169″]I read an interesting comment yesterday (I forget where) regarding NFL players saying where they went to school during introductions. The person said they thought the player shouldn’t be allowed to say “The Ohio State University” or “University of Michigan” if they had not graduated from that school.

    The person equated it with putting a school on a resume’, and that surely anyone who did that, but did not graduate from the school would face criticism or worse. He suggested that only the highest level of school completed be announced on TV. I had never thought about it before, but it does make sense.[/quote]

    I disagree. The player is not misrepresenting that he is a graduate of the school. That is completely different from listing on a resume that a person was graduated from a school. Keep in mind as well that it is common for honest job-seekers to list schools that they attended on a resume, noting that no degree was received therefrom.

  • Pete B | November 16, 2006 at 1:18 pm |

    I’m just watching the Panthers Bucs game I DVR’d, I don’t think Williams is wearing LEDS, his soles are just ultra-shiny, and thus reflect the lights in the stadium

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 1:19 pm |

    [quote comment=”23167″][quote comment=”23161″][quote comment=”23159″]On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?[/quote]

    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.

    2] Many people would dispute Ohio State’s academic reputation. I’m not here, I’m just saying many people would. I’m sure a Michigan fan will jump in for me here.

    3] As Texas Aggie (which do you prefer Texas Aggies or Texas A&M) I would think that you would be more sympathetic to my point of view, what with the Univeristy of Texas running around. At least they don’t refer to themselves as THE University of Texas.[/quote]

    One difference is that “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is the university’s name. It’s not Ohio State University. Gosh, when will you people understand. THINK!! It’s not that hard.[/quote]

    If you think that when Santino Holmes gets introduced on TV and says THE (you simply cannot dispute the emphasis they place on that word) Ohio State University, his concern is only about making it absolutly clear which college he attended, than you are absolutely right. I think that’s nonsense of course, but you are entitled to that opinion.

  • jesse | November 16, 2006 at 1:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23170″][quote comment=”23161″]
    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.quote]

    Cincy is in the Big EAST
    a true football powerhouse conference.

    GO RUTGERS(btw I actually like their red on red look)[/quote]

    I am aware Cincinnati is in the Big East, my point is that if they were in the Big Ten, like Ohio State, they would be one of the larger schools in it.

  • Chris Mewett | November 16, 2006 at 1:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23163″]4] How would you feel if UT made the claim to represent the ENTIRE state of Texas? I think that there might actually be blood shead over that.[/quote]I hate to drag this even further away from uniforms, but I suppose this — as a branding concern — is peripherally related: UT actually DID this for a long time, and many of their alums probably still do. In fact, they ran an ad campaign (on TV and elsewhere) with the tagline “We’re Texas!” You don’t want to get me going on all that. (Incidentally, you may or may not have heard Aggies refer to UT as “t.u.” This is alternatingly explained as “the university” or “texas university,” but this form is intended to show disdain for that institution’s claim to represent the entire state. It’s also instructive to remember that Texas A&M’s student body is very, VERY Texan — probably somewhere in the high 90s percent-wise.)

    I agree with thos who have maede the point about OSU’s official name — it IS “The Ohio State University.” When I hear guys emphasize the “The,” I never thought of it as a suggestion that OSU is “THE, sole, number 1, representative university in Ohio.” And even if that is what they’re saying, is there any reason to dispute this when you’re considering the perspective of intercollegiate athletes?

    I guess when it comes down to it on all this, I could understand your consternation if OSU people were saying “THE Ohio university.” But they’re not. They’re saying “The Ohio State University,” which also happens to be the name of the institution.

    As far as the A&M stuff goes, I liked “Texas Aggies” in the endzones and on the baseball jerseys, and I’d really like to see it on the basketball unis as well. It’s traditional, it’s distinctive, and it flows better — it actually sounds weird to me every time I hear a national television commentator refer to the “Texas A&M Aggies.” To me, the university is Texas A&M and the individuals are Texas Aggies. I have no problem with the former on the unis, but would prefer the latter.

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 1:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23176″][quote comment=”23167″][quote comment=”23161″][quote comment=”23159″]On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?[/quote]

    1] Because there are about 10 other schools playing division one college football in Ohio. Theses are not small schools either. Cincinnati would be one of the larger schools in the Big Ten. Most of the MAC schools have enrolments over 12-15 thousand, some have more than 20 thousand.

    2] Many people would dispute Ohio State’s academic reputation. I’m not here, I’m just saying many people would. I’m sure a Michigan fan will jump in for me here.

    3] As Texas Aggie (which do you prefer Texas Aggies or Texas A&M) I would think that you would be more sympathetic to my point of view, what with the Univeristy of Texas running around. At least they don’t refer to themselves as THE University of Texas.[/quote]

    One difference is that “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is the university’s name. It’s not Ohio State University. Gosh, when will you people understand. THINK!! It’s not that hard.[/quote]

    If you think that when Santino Holmes gets introduced on TV and says THE (you simply cannot dispute the emphasis they place on that word) Ohio State University, his concern is only about making it absolutly clear which college he attended, than you are absolutely right. I think that’s nonsense of course, but you are entitled to that opinion.[/quote]

    It doesn’t matter what the emphasis is when that is the name of the school they go to. What am I missing here?

  • Jim | November 16, 2006 at 1:25 pm |

    Here is an article talking about the extreme measures the NBA is taking to make sure players don’t pull their jerseys out of their shorts.

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 1:28 pm |

    [quote comment=”23178″][quote comment=”23163″]4] How would you feel if UT made the claim to represent the ENTIRE state of Texas? I think that there might actually be blood shead over that.[/quote]I hate to drag this even further away from uniforms, but I suppose this — as a branding concern — is peripherally related: UT actually DID this for a long time, and many of their alums probably still do. In fact, they ran an ad campaign (on TV and elsewhere) with the tagline “We’re Texas!” You don’t want to get me going on all that. (Incidentally, you may or may not have heard Aggies refer to UT as “t.u.” This is alternatingly explained as “the university” or “texas university,” but this form is intended to show disdain for that institution’s claim to represent the entire state. It’s also instructive to remember that Texas A&M’s student body is very, VERY Texan — probably somewhere in the high 90s percent-wise.)

    I agree with thos who have maede the point about OSU’s official name — it IS “The Ohio State University.” When I hear guys emphasize the “The,” I never thought of it as a suggestion that OSU is “THE, sole, number 1, representative university in Ohio.” And even if that is what they’re saying, is there any reason to dispute this when you’re considering the perspective of intercollegiate athletes?

    I guess when it comes down to it on all this, I could understand your consternation if OSU people were saying “THE Ohio university.” But they’re not. They’re saying “The Ohio State University,” which also happens to be the name of the institution.

    As far as the A&M stuff goes, I liked “Texas Aggies” in the endzones and on the baseball jerseys, and I’d really like to see it on the basketball unis as well. It’s traditional, it’s distinctive, and it flows better — it actually sounds weird to me every time I hear a national television commentator refer to the “Texas A&M Aggies.” To me, the university is Texas A&M and the individuals are Texas Aggies. I have no problem with the former on the unis, but would prefer the latter.[/quote]

    Look, Look, Chris Mewett is using his brain!!! Way to go man.

  • tommy | November 16, 2006 at 1:30 pm |

    In Sweden and Finland, leading scorers in the respective hockey leagues wear gold helmets- regardless of their uni-colours. Lose the scoring lead, lose your gold helmet.

  • Pete B | November 16, 2006 at 1:31 pm |

    [quote comment=”23175″]I’m just watching the Panthers Bucs game I DVR’d, I don’t think Williams is wearing LEDS, his soles are just ultra-shiny, and thus reflect the lights in the stadium[/quote]
    Further to that here’s a showing the shinyness.

  • Pete B | November 16, 2006 at 1:32 pm |

    Grr, screen grab is here

  • Chris | November 16, 2006 at 1:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23175″]I’m just watching the Panthers Bucs game I DVR’d, I don’t think Williams is wearing LEDS, his soles are just ultra-shiny, and thus reflect the lights in the stadium[/quote]

    Since my info on DeAngelo Williams and his cleats was glossed over, this is from his blog:
    I also have to tell all the Memphis fans about the makeup of my shoes. I had some shoes made from Nike. For those of you who don’t know, you can’t have anything that’s not team issued or something from another team (college or pro). So what do i do? I tell the guy who built my shoes I want a metalic blue bottom. The guy asked, “why?” I quickly replied that its for the people back home in Memphis, and that he wouldn’t understand. See there is a creed we live by in Memphis: “I’m Tiger blue, I’m Tiger breed, when I die I will be a Tiger fan dead!”…and he still did not understand. I write two words on the bottom of my shoes before I play now! Those two words are PATIENCE and BELIEVE, for the simple reason of how much adversity we were hit with but still prevailed. That is how big my Tiger heart is, how big is yours? GO TIGERS

  • Kim | November 16, 2006 at 1:38 pm |

    [quote comment=”23171″][quote comment=”23152″]

    This is uniform related. It’s about soccer though (yawn).[/quote]That link gives a far-from-comprehensive list of some teams with alcohol sponsorships on their shirts. Here are some images.

    Celtic (Scotland) — Carling
    Rangers (Scotland) — Carling
    Liverpool (England) — Carlsberg
    Everton (England) — Chang
    Wisla Krakow (Poland) — Tyskie
    Arminia Bielefeld (Germany) — Krombacher [Interestingly, this photo shows the players safety-pinning the back of their shirts prior to posing for pictures][/quote]

    Interesting footnote to that. I was at the Celtic -DC United game this year where they had the Coors Light logo on their shirts. We saw them from a distance and thought ‘it sure looks like it says Coors Light, but why would they have that?’ Interesting that they’d tailor their advertising to the local market.

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 1:40 pm |

    It doesn’t matter what the emphasis is when that is the name of the school they go to. What am I missing here?

    You’re missing the fact that emphasis in spoken language can convey a message beyond the printed words. For instance, if Ohio State did make a consistent point (as many of us are arguing they should do) of saying they are “Ohio State” rather than “Ohio,” then if their football alumni were to appear on TV and say “I’m from The Ohio STATE University,” I for one would have no objection. The message conveyed is, “I went to Ohio State and not Ohio U., thank you very much.” The message conveyed by “I’m from THE Ohio State University” is “I went to the only state university in Ohio that matters.”

    So in other words, in the first example only Ohio U. is dissed. In the second, Ohio U. *and* all the other state universities in Ohio are dissed.

    Incidentally, every so often there are discussions about which institution — Ohio State, Oregon State and Oklahoma State — “deserves” to use the “OSU” abbreviation. If Ohio State and its fans/alumni are so enamored of “The Ohio State University,” then maybe they should call themselves “TOSU” for short and take themselves out of that discussion. (Or, since they like to emphasize the definite article, they could call themselves “The OSU.”) It could even be turned into a logo to be placed on uniforms and such. (See, I brought it back to uniforms again!)

  • Ian K | November 16, 2006 at 1:42 pm |

    I live in Texas and I prefer “Texas Aggies” and I’ve never heard a University of Texas alum complain about that. (Secretly I think they believe they’re better than the Aggies, but that’s another topic). There are plenty of D-1 teams in Texas, including my alma mater Texas Christian University, where all we want is just a little respect (or to replace Baylor in the Big 12).

    Hey Paul, glad the article finally made it up so we can talk about unis now…

  • Paul Lukas | November 16, 2006 at 1:45 pm |

    New ESPN column is now up — look here.

  • Pete B | November 16, 2006 at 1:48 pm |

    [quote comment=”23188″]
    Since my info on DeAngelo Williams and his cleats was glossed over, this is from his blog:
    I also have to tell all the Memphis fans about the makeup of my shoes. I had some shoes made from Nike. For those of you who don’t know, you can’t have anything that’s not team issued or something from another team (college or pro). So what do i do? I tell the guy who built my shoes I want a metalic blue bottom. The guy asked, “why?” I quickly replied that its for the people back home in Memphis, and that he wouldn’t understand. See there is a creed we live by in Memphis: “I’m Tiger blue, I’m Tiger breed, when I die I will be a Tiger fan dead!”…and he still did not understand. I write two words on the bottom of my shoes before I play now! Those two words are PATIENCE and BELIEVE, for the simple reason of how much adversity we were hit with but still prevailed. That is how big my Tiger heart is, how big is yours? GO TIGERS[/quote]
    Ah, well found.

  • Chris Mewett | November 16, 2006 at 1:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”23189″]
    Interesting footnote to that. I was at the Celtic -DC United game this year where they had the Coors Light logo on their shirts. We saw them from a distance and thought ‘it sure looks like it says Coors Light, but why would they have that?’ Interesting that they’d tailor their advertising to the local market.[/quote]Carling is owned/brewed by Molson Coors Brewing Company (as, obviously, is Coors Light) and not sold in the US. Considering that on the preseason tours, the shirts usually have no player names and are simply sequentially numbered, I guess it shouldn’t be surprising that they could affix a temporary sponsorship logo. It DOES seem like good foresight, though, to think about the fact that the brand typically advertised on the shirts isn’t sold in the place where the games are being played. Good catch, anyway. Here’s a pic.

  • Jason | November 16, 2006 at 1:50 pm |

    The THE in THE Ohio State University is actually from 1878 when the school’s named changed from Ohio A&M to The Ohio State University. It did not become THE Ohio State University until the tenure of University President E. Gordon Gee. When Gee arrived in the 1990’s, OSU was losing funding, students, and credibility. He began an $85 million campaign to improve the school and its reputation. Along with the money came an emphasis on the The in The Ohio State University. By saying you were from THE Ohio State University you showed that you were proud to be a Buckeye. It was not meant as a slap in the face of other schools in the Buckeye state, just a morale booster for those in Columbus. This turnaround has continued both in the classrooms and on the athletic fields and Buckeyes everywhere are not being cocky by saying THE Ohio State University, they’re just being true to their school.

  • Adam in Chicago | November 16, 2006 at 1:51 pm |

    Regarding Paul’s main page article:

    – How can Rutgers, with their fantastic football unis, screw things up so horribly with basketball?

    – It’s unfortunate that Indiana State moved away from the sycamore leaf side panel design. Great stuff.

    – Central Michigan’s new unis strike me as odd; in my experience, a two-level word mark like that is arched on top and straight on the bottom. These have both top and bottom arched. I like the circular feel this creates. Has it been done before?

  • Kim | November 16, 2006 at 1:55 pm |

    [quote comment=”23185″]In Sweden and Finland, leading scorers in the respective hockey leagues wear gold helmets- regardless of their uni-colours. Lose the scoring lead, lose your gold helmet.[/quote]

    That’s wicked cool.

    Does the helmet designation change by day? I could imagine the tussling if the top two scorers were on the same team and the points total see-sawed during a game…..they could change helmets from shift to shift!

  • DJL | November 16, 2006 at 1:55 pm |

    For the record, many Bucknuts refer to their university as tOSU on message boards. And the majority of attendees at Ohio U. are Ohio residents, and therefore Buckeye fans. There isn’t the disconnect between the MAC schools (OU, BGSU, MU, UT, KSU, etc.) Cincinnati, Dayton, Cleveland State, etc. being against Ohio State because they rarely play against Ohio State in football and basketball.

  • Pat | November 16, 2006 at 1:59 pm |

    I decided I would be nit-picky because that’s what uni-watching is all about right?

    In Paul’s article there is this:
    [quote]But the league office put the kibosh on that idea, citing regulations that require today’s coaches to wear Reebok-branded sportswear (because people are practically sprinting to the mall to buy a polo shirt after seeing it modeled by Andy Reid).[/quote]

    But andy Reid is clearly wearing a Puma polo shirt. I know that all NFL teams are Reebok teams now but how long ago was it when teams were allowed to negotiate their own apparel contracts with whatever company they wanted? That does look like a relatively recent picture of Andy Reid.

  • Miguel | November 16, 2006 at 2:02 pm |

    [quote comment=”23197″]- How can Rutgers, with their fantastic football unis, screw things up so horribly with basketball?
    [/quote]

    Here’s the Rutgers uni from the rear. Take an Aleve or five before clicking.

  • MetsFan AZ | November 16, 2006 at 2:06 pm |

    [quote comment=”23201″][quote comment=”23197″]- How can Rutgers, with their fantastic football unis, screw things up so horribly with basketball?
    [/quote]

    Here’s the Rutgers uni from the rear. Take an Aleve or five before clicking.[/quote]
    At least that one doesn’t have the uh, *roundish* cheerleader in the background.

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 2:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”23196″]The THE in THE Ohio State University is actually from 1878 when the school’s named changed from Ohio A&M to The Ohio State University. It did not become THE Ohio State University until the tenure of University President E. Gordon Gee. When Gee arrived in the 1990’s, OSU was losing funding, students, and credibility. He began an $85 million campaign to improve the school and its reputation. Along with the money came an emphasis on the The in The Ohio State University. By saying you were from THE Ohio State University you showed that you were proud to be a Buckeye. It was not meant as a slap in the face of other schools in the Buckeye state, just a morale booster for those in Columbus. This turnaround has continued both in the classrooms and on the athletic fields and Buckeyes everywhere are not being cocky by saying THE Ohio State University, they’re just being true to their school.[/quote]

    Way to go Jason!!

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 2:12 pm |

    [quote comment=”23190″]It doesn’t matter what the emphasis is when that is the name of the school they go to. What am I missing here?

    You’re missing the fact that emphasis in spoken language can convey a message beyond the printed words. For instance, if Ohio State did make a consistent point (as many of us are arguing they should do) of saying they are “Ohio State” rather than “Ohio,” then if their football alumni were to appear on TV and say “I’m from The Ohio STATE University,” I for one would have no objection. The message conveyed is, “I went to Ohio State and not Ohio U., thank you very much.” The message conveyed by “I’m from THE Ohio State University” is “I went to the only state university in Ohio that matters.”

    So in other words, in the first example only Ohio U. is dissed. In the second, Ohio U. *and* all the other state universities in Ohio are dissed.

    Incidentally, every so often there are discussions about which institution — Ohio State, Oregon State and Oklahoma State — “deserves” to use the “OSU” abbreviation. If Ohio State and its fans/alumni are so enamored of “The Ohio State University,” then maybe they should call themselves “TOSU” for short and take themselves out of that discussion. (Or, since they like to emphasize the definite article, they could call themselves “The OSU.”) It could even be turned into a logo to be placed on uniforms and such. (See, I brought it back to uniforms again!)[/quote]

    It’s not dissing the other schools as has been noted here a little bit after your post. The point is that this is the Universiy’s name so it is not a problem with a player saying “THE Ohio State University” nor will it ever be. It’s placing pride in the university they attended or graduated from and doesn’t disrespect any of the other universities from Ohio. Those players are not saying that it is the only university in Ohio but are saying the name of the University they attendeth with pride. That is perfectly fine.

  • Fraser | November 16, 2006 at 2:13 pm |

    In rugby there is a semi-traditiion of “Shooting the Boot” after a good match (or bad).

    Check it out

  • Dan from PC | November 16, 2006 at 2:17 pm |

    isnt andy reid wearing a puma polo in that picture in the espn column…am i the only one who finds this amusing?

    sorry if it was mentioned, i was at class

  • Dave | November 16, 2006 at 2:19 pm |

    It’s not dissing the other schools as has been noted here a little bit after your post. The point is that this is the Universiy’s name so it is not a problem with a player saying “THE Ohio State University” nor will it ever be. It’s placing pride in the university they attended or graduated from and doesn’t disrespect any of the other universities from Ohio. Those players are not saying that it is the only university in Ohio but are saying the name of the University they attendeth with pride. That is perfectly fine.

    You have to acknowledge, though, that the emphasis on THE can be interpreted as a diss (or, alternatively, in crossing the line between college pride and arrogance) even if it’s not delivered that way. As a Michigan fan, I’m always going to be annoyed by this little habit of OSU fans and alumni anyway, whether or not they are trying to diss anyone, so I’m hardly an impartial observer. But I’m also not the only one posting on this (admittedly not terribly uni-related) topic to make the same interpretation. I can’t imagine that all of them are Michigan fans who just haven’t admitted their loyalties.

  • Kramer | November 16, 2006 at 2:37 pm |

    [quote comment=”23201″][quote comment=”23197″]- How can Rutgers, with their fantastic football unis, screw things up so horribly with basketball?
    [/quote]

    Here’s the Rutgers uni from the rear. Take an Aleve or five before clicking.[/quote]
    i actually like these unis, b/c white anrd red is a nice combination as long as it doesnt go to oregon proportions

    [quote comment=”23207″]It’s not dissing the other schools as has been noted here a little bit after your post. The point is that this is the Universiy’s name so it is not a problem with a player saying “THE Ohio State University” nor will it ever be. It’s placing pride in the university they attended or graduated from and doesn’t disrespect any of the other universities from Ohio. Those players are not saying that it is the only university in Ohio but are saying the name of the University they attendeth with pride. That is perfectly fine.

    You have to acknowledge, though, that the emphasis on THE can be interpreted as a diss (or, alternatively, in crossing the line between college pride and arrogance) even if it’s not delivered that way. As a Michigan fan, I’m always going to be annoyed by this little habit of OSU fans and alumni anyway, whether or not they are trying to diss anyone, so I’m hardly an impartial observer. But I’m also not the only one posting on this (admittedly not terribly uni-related) topic to make the same interpretation. I can’t imagine that all of them are Michigan fans who just haven’t admitted their loyalties.[/quote]

    and this is a lot better than miami saying “the U” that is ignorance because there is hundreds of “U’s” in the country. that is a slap in the face, THE ohio state university is the only THE ohio state university because that is the actual name of it

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 2:38 pm |

    [quote comment=”23207″]It’s not dissing the other schools as has been noted here a little bit after your post. The point is that this is the Universiy’s name so it is not a problem with a player saying “THE Ohio State University” nor will it ever be. It’s placing pride in the university they attended or graduated from and doesn’t disrespect any of the other universities from Ohio. Those players are not saying that it is the only university in Ohio but are saying the name of the University they attendeth with pride. That is perfectly fine.

    You have to acknowledge, though, that the emphasis on THE can be interpreted as a diss (or, alternatively, in crossing the line between college pride and arrogance) even if it’s not delivered that way. As a Michigan fan, I’m always going to be annoyed by this little habit of OSU fans and alumni anyway, whether or not they are trying to diss anyone, so I’m hardly an impartial observer. But I’m also not the only one posting on this (admittedly not terribly uni-related) topic to make the same interpretation. I can’t imagine that all of them are Michigan fans who just haven’t admitted their loyalties.[/quote]

    Just because more people than you assum ethey are dissing the other universities in Ohio doesn’t mean that that is a correct assumption. You can be annoyed by it and more than likely just because you are a Michigan fan. Just being annoyed by something and it dissing other schools is not a good argument. All I am saying is that it is the name of the school. The “The” part is pronounced like “thee” for the school so players saying it this way are fine. So, if Tom Brady intros himself by saying “Tom Brady University of Michigan Wolverines” is that a problem?

  • Kramer | November 16, 2006 at 2:39 pm |

    oregon *ugliness* proportions sorry

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 16, 2006 at 2:43 pm |

    as far as miami goes and what they refer to themselves as, my philosophy on that school is as follows:

    You can’t spell THUG without the U!

    this philosophy was notarized last night when i finally completed reading the ray lewis article in SI.

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 2:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”23213″]as far as miami goes and what they refer to themselves as, my philosophy on that school is as follows:

    You can’t spell THUG without the U!

    this philosophy was notarized last night when i finally completed reading the ray lewis article in SI.[/quote]

    krvanch, that and maybe that’s all the education they have and that’s all they know how to spell and read.

  • BBFAN | November 16, 2006 at 2:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”23198″][quote comment=”23185″]In Sweden and Finland, leading scorers in the respective hockey leagues wear gold helmets- regardless of their uni-colours. Lose the scoring lead, lose your gold helmet.[/quote]

    That’s wicked cool.

    Does the helmet designation change by day? I could imagine the tussling if the top two scorers were on the same team and the points total see-sawed during a game…..they could change helmets from shift to shift![/quote]

    Believe it or not, my buddy plays for IFK in Helsinki, and has played over there for about 4 years. About two years ago, he wore the gold helmet pretty much all year, and actually made off with it at the end of the year. He got married that summer, and pulled out the helmet (complete with an eye shield) at the bachelor party for everyone to take turns wearing.

    Anyways, the leading scorer for each team going into a particular game wears the helmet for that game. There is also cash on the line for each game that you wear it, and at the end of the season for whoever wears it most on each team. According to him, it was pretty ackward at first to wear it, but you get used to it.

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 16, 2006 at 2:48 pm |

    anyone in for an end of the year awards ceremony?
    The UNI’s? The Paulie’s? The Ekky’s? (name can be figured out later)

    was thinking of categories

    Blog topic of the year
    Most overrated/overstated topic
    Most underrated/understated topic
    Uni blunder of the year
    Uni of the year
    The “thats been posted many times already” award (this should automatically go to kenny rogers bp hat)

    just thinking of what could be put together

  • dchis | November 16, 2006 at 2:50 pm |

    [quote comment=”23216″]anyone in for an end of the year awards ceremony?
    The UNI’s? The Paulie’s? The Ekky’s? (name can be figured out later)

    was thinking of categories

    Blog topic of the year
    Most overrated/overstated topic
    Most underrated/understated topic
    Uni blunder of the year
    Uni of the year
    The “thats been posted many times already” award (this should automatically go to kenny rogers bp hat)

    just thinking of what could be put together[/quote]

    Could you add an award to the user who “thats been posted many times already” does this? I think that would be hilarious.

  • Kenny | November 16, 2006 at 2:56 pm |

    [quote comment=”23218″]So Lamar has UA sponsored jerseys but wear Jordan brand shoes?[/quote]

    Whoops…those are actually his compression shorts

    And for some reason these were one of my favorite college basketball unis…too bad they’re gone now

  • Jim H | November 16, 2006 at 2:59 pm |

    Regarding Paul’s main page article:

    – It’s unfortunate that Indiana State moved away from the sycamore leaf side panel design. Great stuff.

    I wish they would go back to the days of Larry Legend myself

  • BBFAN | November 16, 2006 at 3:01 pm |

    A couple of links from the Finnish Elite League.

    Steve Guolla (Played for Altanta in NHL) wearing the golden helmet HIFK:

    http://www.hifk.fi/i...

    How about those ref uniforms. Think they have a strong union or what?

    http://www.hifk.fi/i...

  • Jonathon | November 16, 2006 at 3:03 pm |

    [quote comment=”23218″]So Lamar has UA sponsored jerseys but wear Jordan brand shoes?[/quote]

    i think those are the spandex biker shorts UNDER his unifrom, not the actual uni. look at where the red stripe is on his left leg compared to the right.

  • Kenny | November 16, 2006 at 3:04 pm |
  • MetsFan AZ | November 16, 2006 at 3:04 pm |

    [quote comment=”23219″][quote comment=”23218″]So Lamar has UA sponsored jerseys but wear Jordan brand shoes?[/quote]

    Whoops…those are actually his compression shorts

    And for some reason these were one of my favorite college basketball unis…too bad they’re gone now[/quote]
    both teams in the Lamar pic are refreshingly logo-free (with the exception of the UA).

  • Kenny | November 16, 2006 at 3:05 pm |

    [quote comment=”23224″][quote comment=”23218″]So Lamar has UA sponsored jerseys but wear Jordan brand shoes?[/quote]

    i think those are the spandex biker shorts UNDER his unifrom, not the actual uni. look at where the red stripe is on his left leg compared to the right.[/quote]

    Yeah I gotch ya…look at Comment 129

  • MetsFan AZ | November 16, 2006 at 3:06 pm |

    [quote comment=”23222″]Regarding Paul’s main page article:

    – It’s unfortunate that Indiana State moved away from the sycamore leaf side panel design. Great stuff.

    I wish they would go back to the days of Larry Legend myself[/quote]
    John Stockton is retired, and that is a good thing. But I love the sock stripes.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 3:53 pm |

    Here is a good list of college football rivalry games and their trophies (if applicable). A few other clothing items as trophies that are listed here are the Golden Hat for the UT-OU Red River Shootout and the Dutchmen’s Shoes which is the trophy awarded for the winner of the Rensselaer/Union college rivalry.

    http://en.wikipedia....

    The list is by no means complete though as it neglects to mention the Bayou Bucket which used to be awarded to the winner of the Rice/University of Houston game (do they still award this? Rice/UH people let me know), the Mayor’s Cup which is awarded to the winner of the SMU/Rice game, and of course the Bronze Skillet which the winner of the SMU/TCU game gets (and which SMU currently holds).

  • Kevin | November 16, 2006 at 4:05 pm |

    [quote comment=”23216″]anyone in for an end of the year awards ceremony?
    The UNI’s? The Paulie’s? The Ekky’s? (name can be figured out later)

    was thinking of categories

    Blog topic of the year
    Most overrated/overstated topic
    Most underrated/understated topic
    Uni blunder of the year
    Uni of the year
    The “thats been posted many times already” award (this should automatically go to kenny rogers bp hat)

    just thinking of what could be put together[/quote]

    A couple more:

    Worst uni
    Most improved uni
    Best throwback/retro uni
    Best anniversary/memorial/other patch
    Best typography

  • Rick | November 16, 2006 at 4:06 pm |

    I was watching the Steelers-Saints game on Sunday, and it looked like a tab collar that would be with a tux shirt..

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 4:11 pm |

    This isn’t a clothing related trophy either, but UAB and Memphis play for a trophy that is a bronze rack of ribs. How awesome is that.

    http://en.wikipedia....

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 4:16 pm |

    And yet another list of college rivalries and what they play for.

    http://en.wikipedia....

    Again, not strictly uni related, but interesting nonetheless.

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 16, 2006 at 4:20 pm |

    a. say what you want about osu/mich, and every other rivalry. the BEST rivalry in college football (in my opinion) is the most played game which takes place this weekend, my alma mater, lehigh travels to lafayette for the 142nd meeting of these rival colleges…

    b. as far as coaches go, i think jim tressel’s sideline gear makes him and his team look classy, no matter who (clarett) they recruit, or who (troy smith) they pay.
    http://images.usatod...
    http://i.a.cnn.net/s...

  • Teebz | November 16, 2006 at 4:32 pm |

    [quote comment=”23216″]anyone in for an end of the year awards ceremony?
    The UNI’s? The Paulie’s? The Ekky’s? (name can be figured out later)

    was thinking of categories

    Blog topic of the year
    Most overrated/overstated topic
    Most underrated/understated topic
    Uni blunder of the year
    Uni of the year
    The “thats been posted many times already” award (this should automatically go to kenny rogers bp hat)

    just thinking of what could be put together
    [/quote]

    I fully endorse this idea. I do this on a blog of my own where I had out awards based upon votes from the people that read my blog. It’s a lot of fun.

    So yes… let’s get a Uni Watch Awards Night going. :o)

  • Allison | November 16, 2006 at 4:34 pm |

    [quote comment=”23159″]On “Ohio” vice “OSU”: as an alum of Texas A&M, I’m well acquainted with the complex that some people have about uniforms or logos that display a name other than the official title of the university. A&M’s teams are consistently referred to as the “Texas Aggies” by people familiar with the institution. The baseball team, in fact, has in past years worn jerseys reading “Texas Aggies” (no “A&M”), and the end zones at Kyle Field used to be painted as such. In recent years (since the appointment of Bill Byrne as AD) there has been a shift towards increased usage of “Texas A&M” on uniforms and logos, probably in an effort to eliminate confusion and create stronger associations for marketing and merchandising.

    All of this by way of saying that to most Aggies, there’s no reason that the term “Texas Aggies” would be confusing. A&M doesn’t use this term to steal the University of Texas’ thunder (though it amuses me that “Texas Aggies” burns them up so much) or to intentionally create confusion. There used to be Oklahoma Aggies (Oklahoma A&M, now Oklahoma State), New Mexico Aggies, and Utah Aggies. The Texas Aggies were in College Station and attended Texas A&M. They were the agricultural, engineering, working-man’s alternative to the effete, white-collar, liberal education one received in Austin.

    In any event, Ohio State is clearly the flagship university of the state, even if there IS an Ohio University. It’s larger and much more well-respected nationwide, both athletically and academically. It seems clear that they’re Ohio’s football team in much the same way that LSU is Louisiana’s (not ULa-Lafayette or ULa-Monroe). So why are we surprised that they would claim to represent the entire state?[/quote]

    That picture of the field from the jet is probably one of the coolest pictures I’ve ever seen.

    And I’m sure that if the Iowa State marching band can spell out “Go Cyclones”, then the OSU band can spell out “Ohio State”. But then again, the ISU band made a picture of Cartman, Homer Simpson saying “Doh!”, and this weekend for Coach Mac’s last game will make a picture of good old Dan himself.

    Today is probably the most off-topic day this site has seen in a while.

  • Mike | November 16, 2006 at 4:47 pm |

    Apparently they took away spelling class at the Naval Academy… check out the error.

  • Andy | November 16, 2006 at 4:53 pm |

    [quote comment=”23241″]
    Today is probably the most off-topic day this site has seen in a while.[/quote]

    There is one topic that trumps all other topics this week. It’s THE topic.

  • Caknuck | November 16, 2006 at 4:58 pm |

    I like how the English team (“the Olympics”, the second linked image) can’t afford their own set of unis or helmet decals, but that one back has a brand new Revolution helmet.

  • Joe | November 16, 2006 at 4:58 pm |

    my problem with the whole THE ohio state thing is this. Didnt OSU sue Oklahoma a few years ago for using the OSU moniker? If thats the case, whouldnt it always be TOSU? if ‘THE’ is part of the name, why not include it in the abreviation?

    Go Rutgers!(which abreviates their college as RU, or in rare cases, TSUNJ)

  • Jason | November 16, 2006 at 5:05 pm |

    The Rangers and Astros play for the Silver Boot in a recently fabricated “tradition.”

  • Matt B | November 16, 2006 at 5:11 pm |

    D-7 Wisconsin football. It’s uni-licious.

    That’s Gilman in full-body purple and Eleva-Strum in black / white.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 5:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”23247″]The Rangers and Astros play for the Silver Boot in a recently fabricated “tradition.”[/quote]

    The series is actually on it’s second boot trophy. The first trophy had a lot of glass in it’s construction. The Astros, while traveling with it two years ago accidentally broke it and presented it to the Rangers as such. I believe now the new trophy has much less glass in it.

  • Teebz | November 16, 2006 at 5:23 pm |

    In perhaps one of the funniest of traditions, the Saskatchewan Roughriders and Winnipeg Blue Bombers of the CFL play in the Banjo Bowl following the Labour Day matchup.

    You can read about how the game got its name here.

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 5:24 pm |

    [quote comment=”23243″][quote comment=”23241″]
    Today is probably the most off-topic day this site has seen in a while.[/quote]

    There is one topic that trumps all other topics this week. It’s THE topic.[/quote]

    Andy, that was the perfect response. Thanks for the laugh over a much-debated topic. My quick hits:

    Teebz, what’s your website? Is it sports-related?

    I agree with Dave about The Ohio State University. I highly doubt the former players are giving props to the full name rather than being cocky. The reason it’s cocky, dchis, is because if they were simply stating the name, the natural inflection would be The Ohio State University, rather than The OSU. It annoys the hell out of me, just as it annoys me when a player says he’s from The U. I’m not a Mee-chigan fan, either, so it’s not a biased thing.

    Then again, I have wondered for years why they say where they went to school at all. NBA players don’t do that, nor do MLB players.

    todd k., I like your idea about uni awards. The color never to be found anywhere near sports: pink. That’s my contribution.

    Kenny, I like the picture of Bryant’s bare ass. He has a nice ass.

    Did you guys notice Tessa’s post from a couple nights ago that St. Paul is the patron saint of clothing? How apropos for this board. Paul, the capital of MN is St. Paul, as you undoubtably know. This is kismet—you have to come here!

    Pete B. and Chris, thanks yor the info and pic on Williams’ blue shoes. I like. I also like the collared shirts. I hope the No Fun League doesn’t put the kibosh on either.

    Finally, I am still not totally for the suit move in the NFL, but it’s better than the angry homeless man look. I still advocate slacks and a nice shirt, but I think I’m fighting a lost cause.

    I’m out.

  • todd krevanchi (krvanch) | November 16, 2006 at 5:28 pm |

    [quote comment=”23246″]my problem with the whole THE ohio state thing is this. Didnt OSU sue Oklahoma a few years ago for using the OSU moniker? If thats the case, whouldnt it always be TOSU? if ‘THE’ is part of the name, why not include it in the abreviation?

    Go Rutgers!(which abreviates their college as RU, or in rare cases, TSUNJ)[/quote]

    hmm. tsunj? pronounced soonj i guess? the greatest use of the consonant combination TS at the beginning of a word since massachusetts senator Paul Tsongas (or as he said thawngiss). umass lowell plays in an arena named for him…

    [quote comment=”23240″]I fully endorse this idea. I do this on a blog of my own where I had out awards based upon votes from the people that read my blog. It’s a lot of fun.

    So yes… let’s get a Uni Watch Awards Night going. :o)[/quote]

    ok, im gonna go against my biggest pet peeve on this board and say this (but just this once!)

    “THE PURPLE CARPET”
    http://cmerry.diaryl...

    oh, and im gonna have to see if sue bird, sienna miller, keira knightley or natalie portman is available for that night… im not showing up at the ekky’s without a date! i think sue would appreciate it more though, being an athlete an all, but she should be leaving for russia soon… damn…hmm, wonder what will be in the gift bag we get?

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 5:36 pm |

    [quote comment=”23253″][quote comment=”23243″][quote comment=”23241″]

    Then again, I have wondered for years why they say where they went to school at all. NBA players don’t do that, nor do MLB players. /quote]

    In the NBA, the PA announcers, when doing the starting lineups, usually announce where player went to school. If that player (like Kobe) did not attend college, the PA announcer will often say the name of his high school instead.

    You are correct about baseball though, you hardly ever hear a player’s alma mater mentioned unless it is done so by the play by play or color guys.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 5:37 pm |

    And I screwed up the Italics tag on that quote. Everything from ‘In the NBA…’ down is me, the quote above that is from Minna H.

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 5:40 pm |

    [quote comment=”23254″]

    oh, and im gonna have to see if sue bird, sienna miller, keira knightley or natalie portman is available for that night… im not showing up at the ekky’s without a date! i think sue would appreciate it more though, being an athlete an all, but she should be leaving for russia soon… damn…hmm, wonder what will be in the gift bag we get?[/quote]

    the ekkys….I REALLY like that. Hey, teebz, how’s it going on my Christmas present? He could double as my date for the Ekkys—or the guy behind him. I like Hines Ward, too. He’s half Korean.

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 5:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23256″]

    In the NBA, the PA announcers, when doing the starting lineups, usually announce where player went to school. If that player (like Kobe) did not attend college, the PA announcer will often say the name of his high school instead.

    You are correct about baseball though, you hardly ever hear a player’s alma mater mentioned unless it is done so by the play by play or color guys.[/quote]

    Really? I’ve never been to a NBA game live, so I didn’t know that. Huh. Thanks for updating me. I still see no need to know that information, however.

    Oh, Matthew S., good post last night about product endorsement versus logo creep. I couldn’t have said it better myself.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 5:51 pm |

    [quote comment=”23259″][quote comment=”23256″]

    In the NBA, the PA announcers, when doing the starting lineups, usually announce where player went to school. If that player (like Kobe) did not attend college, the PA announcer will often say the name of his high school instead.

    You are correct about baseball though, you hardly ever hear a player’s alma mater mentioned unless it is done so by the play by play or color guys.[/quote]

    Really? I’ve never been to a NBA game live, so I didn’t know that. Huh. Thanks for updating me. I still see no need to know that information, however.

    Oh, Matthew S., good post last night about product endorsement versus logo creep. I couldn’t have said it better myself.[/quote]

    I don’t think all arena PA announcers do it, but next time your watching a local broadcast of a basketball team (as opposed to ESPN or TNT), they might show that part. They do this at Rockets games. This is how I know that Scottie Pippen went to the University of Central Arkansas.

    Thanks Minna. It was so late when I wrote it that I didn’t think anyone would see it. I figured my insomnia might as well be put to good use.

  • Chris | November 16, 2006 at 5:58 pm |

    [quote comment=”23201″][quote comment=”23197″]- How can Rutgers, with their fantastic football unis, screw things up so horribly with basketball?
    [/quote]

    Here’s the Rutgers uni from the rear. Take an Aleve or five before clicking.[/quote]

    Well at least my Memphis Tigers aren’t the only ones with that ugly ass adidas uni design.

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 6:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”23260″][quote comment=”23259″]

    Really? I’ve never been to a NBA game live, so I didn’t know that. Huh. Thanks for updating me. I still see no need to know that information, however.

    Oh, Matthew S., good post last night about product endorsement versus logo creep. I couldn’t have said it better myself.[/quote]

    I don’t think all arena PA announcers do it, but next time your watching a local broadcast of a basketball team (as opposed to ESPN or TNT), they might show that part. They do this at Rockets games. This is how I know that Scottie Pippen went to the University of Central Arkansas.

    Thanks Minna. It was so late when I wrote it that I didn’t think anyone would see it. I figured my insomnia might as well be put to good use.[/quote]

    See, that’s my problem. I turn the game on at the last possible minute before tip-off. Next time, I’ll have to turn it on earlier and see what high school Garnett attended.

    The thing I liked about your post, Matthew, is that you were informative and articulate about a somewhat heated subjectwithout being inflammatory. Kudos to you.

    Oh, and I found that first pic you posted. The logo creep is terrifying, but the guy himself is kind of creepy, so that might have added to my distress.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 6:17 pm |

    [quote comment=”23262″][quote comment=”23260″][quote comment=”23259″]

    Really? I’ve never been to a NBA game live, so I didn’t know that. Huh. Thanks for updating me. I still see no need to know that information, however.

    Oh, Matthew S., good post last night about product endorsement versus logo creep. I couldn’t have said it better myself.[/quote]

    I don’t think all arena PA announcers do it, but next time your watching a local broadcast of a basketball team (as opposed to ESPN or TNT), they might show that part. They do this at Rockets games. This is how I know that Scottie Pippen went to the University of Central Arkansas.

    Thanks Minna. It was so late when I wrote it that I didn’t think anyone would see it. I figured my insomnia might as well be put to good use.[/quote]

    See, that’s my problem. I turn the game on at the last possible minute before tip-off.

    Next time, I’ll have to turn it on earlier and see what high school Garnett attended.

    The thing I liked about your post, Matthew, is that you were informative and articulate about a somewhat heated subjectwithout being inflammatory. Kudos to you.

    Oh, and I found that first pic you posted. The logo creep is terrifying, but the guy himself is kind of creepy, so that might have added to my distress.[/quote]

    And the funny thing about those pictures is that all I had to do was google ‘Finnish Hockey League’ and those pictures came up. As annoying as logo creep can be here in the states, it is epidemic overseas.

    Thanks again for your generous compliments. Even though I was writing at 2:30am Texas time, I was still able to have decent grammar and spelling. Yet when I’m at work in the middle of the day I have trouble with both. Go figure.

    Mexican and South American soccer (er, futbol) leagues are also great mines for logo creep evidence.

  • Chris Doran | November 16, 2006 at 6:18 pm |

    Reading that article about the NBA rules from the NY paper…
    Players are not allowed to sway during the national anthem???

    Us Puckheads should be glad that these rules are not in the NHL, 90% of the players would be fined!

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 6:32 pm |

    [quote comment=”23263″]

    And the funny thing about those pictures is that all I had to do was google ‘Finnish Hockey League’ and those pictures came up. As annoying as logo creep can be here in the states, it is epidemic overseas.

    Thanks again for your generous compliments. Even though I was writing at 2:30am Texas time, I was still able to have decent grammar and spelling. Yet when I’m at work in the middle of the day I have trouble with both. Go figure.

    Mexican and South American soccer (er, futbol) leagues are also great mines for logo creep evidence.[/quote]

    The thing is, most other countries’ leagues aren’t as rich as the major American leagues, which means more corporate sponsorship, and therefore, more logo creep. I don’t think we’re far-off from it here.

    Interesting op-ed on stadium logo creep here.

    By the way, Matthew, you wrote your post last night at 1:30 a.m. I know because I read it before I went to bed, and I retired at 2 a.m., MN time—which is the same as Texas time. Either way, it’s probably the fact that you were interested in what you were writing that made it easier to write than something for work.

  • bj | November 16, 2006 at 6:45 pm |

    [quote comment=”23157″][quote comment=”23149″][quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”[/quote]

    The omission of State is part and parcel of the THE Ohio State University quandary. It is two parts of the same “cocky gesture” indicating that Ohio State is “the [only] school that matters”.
    For the record I think it is also lame and arrogant when alumni of the Miami (Florida) football program refer to themselves as “the U”. I think that the “THE” thing is the same type of gesture, but I think it’s really lame because of who is it is directed at. Seriously, Ohio Univ.? Akron? Bowling Green (State University, for the record)? Cincinnati? What’s the deal? Which Ohio state university are they afraid they are being confused with? Do they really need to emphasize that they are better than these teams?

    Or does it just make them look cocky, like somebody from the U.[/quote]

    The phrase “the U” and the gesture that goes with it are used to pay homage to the Hurricanes’ logo, which happens to be a U.

  • Chad G | November 16, 2006 at 7:01 pm |

    Feng Shui

  • Chad G | November 16, 2006 at 7:03 pm |

    [quote comment=”23268″]Feng Shui[/quote]

    Ahhhhhhhhh, I cut instead of copied

    give me a sec to explain

  • Chad G | November 16, 2006 at 7:08 pm |

    [quote comment=”23263″][quote comment=”23262″][quote comment=”23260″][quote comment=”23259″]

    Really? I’ve never been to a NBA game live, so I didn’t know that. Huh. Thanks for updating me. I still see no need to know that information, however.

    Oh, Matthew S., good post last night about product endorsement versus logo creep. I couldn’t have said it better myself.[/quote]

    I don’t think all arena PA announcers do it, but next time your watching a local broadcast of a basketball team (as opposed to ESPN or TNT), they might show that part. They do this at Rockets games. This is how I know that Scottie Pippen went to the University of Central Arkansas.

    Thanks Minna. It was so late when I wrote it that I didn’t think anyone would see it. I figured my insomnia might as well be put to good use.[/quote]

    See, that’s my problem. I turn the game on at the last possible minute before tip-off.

    Next time, I’ll have to turn it on earlier and see what high school Garnett attended.

    The thing I liked about your post, Matthew, is that you were informative and articulate about a somewhat heated subjectwithout being inflammatory. Kudos to you.

    Oh, and I found that first pic you posted. The logo creep is terrifying, but the guy himself is kind of creepy, so that might have added to my distress.[/quote]

    And the funny thing about those pictures is that all I had to do was google ‘Finnish Hockey League’ and those pictures came up. As annoying as logo creep can be here in the states, it is epidemic overseas.

    Thanks again for your generous compliments. Even though I was writing at 2:30am Texas time, I was still able to have decent grammar and spelling. Yet when I’m at work in the middle of the day I have trouble with both. Go figure.

    Mexican and South American soccer (er, futbol) leagues are also great mines for logo creep evidence.[/quote]

    If you work in cubicle world like I do you are probably in constant fear of someone catching you doing something that you shouldn’t (i.e. Uni watching). This is likely another cause of the bad grammar and spelling, I know it is for me. I hate this back to the world thing, whoever invented the cubicle should be shot and put through a meat grinder. I get the practicality but it totally goes against human nature. We like to see whats coming, not get stabbed in the back. Seriously, this is totally messing with my Feng Shui.

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 7:13 pm |

    [quote comment=”23271″]

    If you work in cubicle world like I do you are probably in constant fear of someone catching you doing something that you shouldn’t (i.e. Uni watching). This is likely another cause of the bad grammar and spelling, I know it is for me. I hate this back to the world thing, whoever invented the cubicle should be shot and put through a meat grinder. I get the practicality but it totally goes against human nature. We like to see whats coming, not get stabbed in the back. Seriously, this is totally messing with my Feng Shui.[/quote]

    Makes sense, Chad G. I hate having my back to a room—feels very exposed.

    I was curious how you were going to work Feng Shui into a conversation about unis. When you just posted Feng Shui, I was going to respond, “gesundheit”, but then i thought better of it.

  • Mike | November 16, 2006 at 7:27 pm |

    Interesting sleeves #45 is wearing in the BAFL.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 7:38 pm |

    [quote comment=”23265″][quote comment=”23263″]

    And the funny thing about those pictures is that all I had to do was google ‘Finnish Hockey League’ and those pictures came up. As annoying as logo creep can be here in the states, it is epidemic overseas.

    Thanks again for your generous compliments. Even though I was writing at 2:30am Texas time, I was still able to have decent grammar and spelling. Yet when I’m at work in the middle of the day I have trouble with both. Go figure.

    Mexican and South American soccer (er, futbol) leagues are also great mines for logo creep evidence.[/quote]

    The thing is, most other countries’ leagues aren’t as rich as the major American leagues, which means more corporate sponsorship, and therefore, more logo creep. I don’t think we’re far-off from it here.

    Interesting op-ed on stadium logo creep here.

    By the way, Matthew, you wrote your post last night at 1:30 a.m. I know because I read it before I went to bed, and I retired at 2 a.m., MN time—which is the same as Texas time. Either way, it’s probably the fact that you were interested in what you were writing that made it easier to write than something for work.[/quote]

    It was 1:30? I couldn’t remember the exact time as I was wrapped up in writing and finding the appropriate examples of atrocious logo creep. I think my grammar/spelling are better when typing comments at home rather than at work because at work I’m typing quickly lest, as Chad said, someone pass my cubicle and see that I’m not on a work related website.

    And actually my job doesn’t involve much writing unfortunately, mostly number crunching. And Chad I agree, cubicles are soul crushing inventions.

    An interesting question regarding logo creep overseas comes from the English Premiership: teams have nicknames (e.g. Arsenal Gunners, Bolton Wanderers, Liverpool Reds, Manchester United Red Devils, Chelsea Blues, West Ham U. Hammers…you get the idea), but to my knowledge these nicknames have never appeared on jerseys. In fact, some of these nicknames come come from a team’s uniform colors (e.g. Liverpool and Chelsea). So while in European hockey leagues uniforms are so splattered with sponsor logos that you can’t even tell what the team’s nickname is, EPL teams usually don’t have more than one or two sponsors on their jersey. This logo creep is far less egregious. So I guess the question is this: are there degrees of logo creep? Can some sponsor logos be considered acceptable? I would have said yes until Minna mentioned that our leagues on this side of the pond are probably heading the way of European leagues. So while I’m ok with a few small sponsor logos on EPL teams, I would never want to see this on any pro team here.

    Not sure what prompted such a long post. Everyone feel free to pick my reasoning apart.

  • ThresherK | November 16, 2006 at 8:08 pm |

    Currently watching Colgate @ UConn womens’ basketball on TV. The Colgate women have a racerback, but non-skintight jersey. (Sorry, no screengrab.) It moved the numbers down on the jersey, lower than they seem they ought to be.

    Anyone seen this elsewhere on the college scene?

    If memory serves, the Aussies or someone else did this with a form-fitting uni in the last Olympics. Surprised to see it stateside.

  • Bryan S | November 16, 2006 at 8:11 pm |

    I haven’t read all of the previous posts, so I’m not sure if anyone mentioned this yet, but In this week’s issue of SI, Rick Reilly’s column is entirely about logo creep. Pretty funny stuff.

  • Matt Bonnett | November 16, 2006 at 8:26 pm |

    [quote] An interesting question regarding logo creep overseas comes from the English Premiership: teams have nicknames (e.g. Arsenal Gunners, Bolton Wanderers, Liverpool Reds, Manchester United Red Devils, Chelsea Blues, West Ham U. Hammers…you get the idea), but to my knowledge these nicknames have never appeared on jerseys. In fact, some of these nicknames come come from a team’s uniform colors (e.g. Liverpool and Chelsea). So while in European hockey leagues uniforms are so splattered with sponsor logos that you can’t even tell what the team’s nickname is, EPL teams usually don’t have more than one or two sponsors on their jersey. This logo creep is far less egregious. So I guess the question is this: are there degrees of logo creep? Can some sponsor logos be considered acceptable? I would have said yes until Minna mentioned that our leagues on this side of the pond are probably heading the way of European leagues. So while I’m ok with a few small sponsor logos on EPL teams, I would never want to see this on any pro team here.[/quote]

    To answer your question needs more info. Some teams you mentioned are nicknames, not proper names, arsenal are not called arsenal gunners, but just arsenal, bolton wanderers are called just that, that is their correct name, actually their nickname is the terriers…i wont explain ;-)

    Some nicknames are worth more than others. Nicknames like “The Gunners” for Arsenal for example are fairly unique, it refers to the very origins of the club hence the club crest has a gun on it.

    Others like “reds” or “blues” as you say are purely dependent on the colours worn and as such actually change depending on the home and away unis.

    A favourite colour for road unis is yellow, hence many visiting fans chant “Yellow, Yellow” in a monotonic manner as a chant, in that case you would not call them the blues or the reds, it is purely a function of the colour they are wearing on that day.

    As for logo creep, clubs are allowed the following in the epl: a sponsor, a club crest and a uni manufacturer logo eg everton (my team) have Chang Beer as their main sponsor, a club crest and an Umbro logo as their uni manufacturer. Their nickname “the toffees” appears nowhere on the kit.

    A common joke this side of the pond is that the lower down the leagues a club is, the more sponsors it is allowed, i.e. teams below the EPL are allowed separate sponsors for their shorts and even socks the lower down you go. Money is tight down there so more sponsorships are allowed.

  • bj | November 16, 2006 at 8:43 pm |

    [quote comment=”23273″]Interesting sleeves #45 is wearing in the BAFL.[/quote]

    that’s got to be a keeper jersey.

  • Matthew S. | November 16, 2006 at 9:00 pm |

    [quote comment=”23277″][quote] An interesting question regarding logo creep overseas comes from the English Premiership: teams have nicknames (e.g. Arsenal Gunners, Bolton Wanderers, Liverpool Reds, Manchester United Red Devils, Chelsea Blues, West Ham U. Hammers…you get the idea), but to my knowledge these nicknames have never appeared on jerseys. In fact, some of these nicknames come come from a team’s uniform colors (e.g. Liverpool and Chelsea). So while in European hockey leagues uniforms are so splattered with sponsor logos that you can’t even tell what the team’s nickname is, EPL teams usually don’t have more than one or two sponsors on their jersey. This logo creep is far less egregious. So I guess the question is this: are there degrees of logo creep? Can some sponsor logos be considered acceptable? I would have said yes until Minna mentioned that our leagues on this side of the pond are probably heading the way of European leagues. So while I’m ok with a few small sponsor logos on EPL teams, I would never want to see this on any pro team here.[/quote]

    To answer your question needs more info. Some teams you mentioned are nicknames, not proper names, arsenal are not called arsenal gunners, but just arsenal, bolton wanderers are called just that, that is their correct name, actually their nickname is the terriers…i wont explain ;-)

    Some nicknames are worth more than others. Nicknames like “The Gunners” for Arsenal for example are fairly unique, it refers to the very origins of the club hence the club crest has a gun on it.

    Others like “reds” or “blues” as you say are purely dependent on the colours worn and as such actually change depending on the home and away unis.

    A favourite colour for road unis is yellow, hence many visiting fans chant “Yellow, Yellow” in a monotonic manner as a chant, in that case you would not call them the blues or the reds, it is purely a function of the colour they are wearing on that day.

    As for logo creep, clubs are allowed the following in the epl: a sponsor, a club crest and a uni manufacturer logo eg everton (my team) have Chang Beer as their main sponsor, a club crest and an Umbro logo as their uni manufacturer. Their nickname “the toffees” appears nowhere on the kit.

    A common joke this side of the pond is that the lower down the leagues a club is, the more sponsors it is allowed, i.e. teams below the EPL are allowed separate sponsors for their shorts and even socks the lower down you go. Money is tight down there so more sponsorships are allowed.[/quote]

    That’s essentially what I was saying, but I’m glad you went into greater detail. Team nicknames in the EPL are more informal nicknames than official monikers.

    My point though was whether some degree of logo creep is acceptable since most teams uniforms in the EPL lack any sort of logo other than the team badge and small manufacturer logo. I would say yes since EPL teams have sported sponsor logos since roughly 1980 and since I’ve only been following the EPL for 10 years or so, I’m used to the sponsors being there. That being said, it’s kind of a double standard since I would probably violently rebel if sponsor logos starting appearing on baseball, football, basketball, or hockey uniforms (especially my beloved Astros).

  • matt dub | November 16, 2006 at 9:04 pm |

    81 for pitt, who just laid that nasty block on the punt return, is clearly wearing a nike undershirt, complete with goofy sleeve design, when pitt is an adidas school.

  • bg | November 16, 2006 at 9:06 pm |

    [quote comment=”23151″][quote comment=”23149″][quote comment=”23146″][quote comment=”23143″][quote comment=”23132″]>On a larger scale, defeating Michigan is a state >pride sort of thing. Why not have the state name >instead of an acronym?

    So when the marching band spells out “Ohio” instead of “Ohio State” — which, after all, they do at all games, not just against Michigan — your explanation is that they are paying tribute to the state of Ohio rather than Ohio State University?[/quote]

    How many members do you want this band to have? Why not have them spell out “Ohio State University Buckeyes?” There’s a very limited amount of letters that one band can spell out.

    Unless there is some very offended Bobcats out there somewhere I don’t see the big deal.[/quote]

    I’m not sure “offended” is the word. Ohio State is by far the largest institution in Ohio, and it certainly has more exposure publicly because of its athletic programs. But it not THE (as in only) State University in Ohio, as their fans and players assert to the disrespect of at least 20 other public universities in the State including the University of Ohio, which is older. The insinuation that it is, made every single time one of their football alumni announces that they went to THE Ohio State University is obnoxious.[/quote]

    They aren’t saying they are the only university in Ohio. It’s a cocky, arrogance thing that every athlete has. They say “THE Ohio State University” like “yea, there are others, but this is THE Ohio state university that matters.” I’m sure there are plenty of other schools that do a similar cocky gesture.

    But, this still doesn’t explain the objection to the omitting of the “State.”[/quote]

    Umm…. the title “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is the universities actual title. No, I don’t like them referring to themselves as Ohio, but to say that it is just being cocky by saying “THE OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY” is wrong. That phrase is the name of the school just like Michigan is “University of Michigan.”[/quote]

    I always like it on MNF when the olayers say, (name,) THE Ohio State University.

    =bg=
    THE Univ of Cincinnati ’84

  • Dre | November 16, 2006 at 9:07 pm |

    [quote comment=”23280″]81 for pitt, who just laid that nasty block on the punt return, is clearly wearing a nike undershirt, complete with goofy sleeve design, when pitt is an adidas school.[/quote]

    Was it the mismatched sleeves or the big blue swoosh that gave it away?!? you beat me to the comment! Kinder #81 isn’t the only one wearing that either, there was another player but I didn’t catch his number. Great play though

  • Dre | November 16, 2006 at 9:14 pm |

    Actually, Kinder #81 for Pitt must have just gotten told to cover it up because he had an adidas armband covering the swoosh.

  • John | November 16, 2006 at 9:36 pm |

    Just got back from the Lehigh-Michigan wrestling match, and it appears the Michigan coaches have blue polos with the same shoulder striping as the new basketball unis. This is the only picture I could find, but you get the idea of how it looks:

    Michigan Wrestling Coach

  • John | November 16, 2006 at 9:37 pm |

    Just to add to my last post, the polos are made by Nike and have a large swoosh on the left shoulder.

  • Jeff I | November 16, 2006 at 9:45 pm |

    I really wish the Bruins would make their vintage jersey permanent:

    http://espn-i.starwa...

  • Anthony M | November 16, 2006 at 9:49 pm |

    [quote comment=”23286″]I really wish the Bruins would make their vintage jersey permanent:

    http://espn-i.starwa...

    That was a sexy looking game.

  • Mark | November 16, 2006 at 10:13 pm |

    [quote]

    I always like it on MNF when the olayers say, (name,) THE Ohio State University.

    =bg=
    THE Univ of Cincinnati ’84[/quote]
    FWIW, i always thought that THE Ohio State University was born from a lawsuit with Ohio University. I can’t find anything to confirm that, but maybe some savvy commUNIty member knows. I seem to remember that, as my brother and sister graduated from Ohio University and my wife graduated from THE Ohio State University.

    MHF
    THE University of Cincinnati, 2001 (little shout out to fellow bearcat BG there)

  • Parker | November 16, 2006 at 10:28 pm |

    [quote comment=”23236″]And yet another list of college rivalries and what they play for.

    http://en.wikipedia....

    Again, not strictly uni related, but interesting nonetheless.[/quote]

    The Civil War (Oregon St. Beavers vs Oregon Ducks) trophy is missing from that list (which is understandable seeing as how it was lost in the 60’s or something – there was an article about in the Oregonian last year). Anyway, the trophy is actually, truly, a platypus. I think that’s hilarious and they really need to bring it back.

    To make this uni-related, though I’m an Oregon St. fan, I think the Civil War might be the most atrocious-looking rivalry game in the country.

  • DH | November 16, 2006 at 10:29 pm |

    [quote comment=”23228″][quote comment=”23222″]Regarding Paul’s main page article:

    – It’s unfortunate that Indiana State moved away from the sycamore leaf side panel design. Great stuff.

    I wish they would go back to the days of Larry Legend myself[/quote]
    John Stockton is retired, and that is a good thing. But I love the sock stripes.[/quote]

    As a student at ISU, it was disappointing to see the Sycamore leaf absent from the uniform. Also, there has been talk on campus how it would be cool to see the shape of Indiana being used as the “I” in Indiana State once again like in the days of Bird, but use the “Sycamore Blue” instead of the powder blue used before ISU was the “Sycamores.”

  • Parker | November 16, 2006 at 10:30 pm |

    Here’s a link that talks about the platypus

  • Al | November 16, 2006 at 10:49 pm |

    [quote comment=”23277″][quote] An interesting question regarding logo creep overseas comes from the English Premiership: teams have nicknames (e.g. Arsenal Gunners, Bolton Wanderers, Liverpool Reds, Manchester United Red Devils, Chelsea Blues, West Ham U. Hammers…you get the idea), but to my knowledge these nicknames have never appeared on jerseys. In fact, some of these nicknames come come from a team’s uniform colors (e.g. Liverpool and Chelsea). So while in European hockey leagues uniforms are so splattered with sponsor logos that you can’t even tell what the team’s nickname is, EPL teams usually don’t have more than one or two sponsors on their jersey. This logo creep is far less egregious. So I guess the question is this: are there degrees of logo creep? Can some sponsor logos be considered acceptable? I would have said yes until Minna mentioned that our leagues on this side of the pond are probably heading the way of European leagues. So while I’m ok with a few small sponsor logos on EPL teams, I would never want to see this on any pro team here.[/quote]

    To answer your question needs more info. Some teams you mentioned are nicknames, not proper names, arsenal are not called arsenal gunners, but just arsenal, bolton wanderers are called just that, that is their correct name, actually their nickname is the terriers…i wont explain ;-)

    Some nicknames are worth more than others. Nicknames like “The Gunners” for Arsenal for example are fairly unique, it refers to the very origins of the club hence the club crest has a gun on it.

    Others like “reds” or “blues” as you say are purely dependent on the colours worn and as such actually change depending on the home and away unis.

    A favourite colour for road unis is yellow, hence many visiting fans chant “Yellow, Yellow” in a monotonic manner as a chant, in that case you would not call them the blues or the reds, it is purely a function of the colour they are wearing on that day.

    As for logo creep, clubs are allowed the following in the epl: a sponsor, a club crest and a uni manufacturer logo eg everton (my team) have Chang Beer as their main sponsor, a club crest and an Umbro logo as their uni manufacturer. Their nickname “the toffees” appears nowhere on the kit.

    A common joke this side of the pond is that the lower down the leagues a club is, the more sponsors it is allowed, i.e. teams below the EPL are allowed separate sponsors for their shorts and even socks the lower down you go. Money is tight down there so more sponsorships are allowed.[/quote]
    Well Said Matt, I was going to attempt to jump in to relay to the question, but i’m glad you did, instead. You are mostly spot on… except i’m going to flip on my pedantic cap and say that Bolton Wanderers are the Trotters, no? Being a Rovers follower, I should know that !!!!

  • Al | November 16, 2006 at 10:54 pm |

    relay s/b reply. wow… must be time for bed.

  • Teebz | November 16, 2006 at 11:01 pm |

    [quote comment=”23253″]
    Teebz, what’s your website? Is it sports-related?
    [/quote]

    Nope. Since hockey is the only real focus of my sports love, it’s got zero to do with sports. But my faithful readers seem to like it. And that’s all that matters. :o)

  • Minna H | November 16, 2006 at 11:33 pm |

    [quote comment=”23296″][quote comment=”23253″]
    Teebz, what’s your website? Is it sports-related?
    [/quote]

    Nope. Since hockey is the only real focus of my sports love, it’s got zero to do with sports. But my faithful readers seem to like it. And that’s all that matters. :o)[/quote]

    Guess what, Teebz? Despite you being all mysterious, I found you, anyway. Ha! Don’t worry, I won’t tell anybody…

    It wouldn’t kill you to throw a hockey jersey on your site now and then….

  • Kyle Oetman | November 16, 2006 at 11:47 pm |

    Here’s a late entry to Paul’s list of new college basketball uniforms. Virginia Tech has switched from the adidas jerseys that it has worn for the last few years to a new Nike design
    new Nike design. I also noticed that the new shorts
    new shorts are a recycling of Butler’s old Nike template
    Butler’s old Nike template.

    I don’t think the tops and shorts really match, but there is one thing that I really like: the vertically arched lettering
    vertically arched lettering on the back nameplate matches the ‘VIRGINIA TECH’ VAL on the front (plus it looks good for players with longer surnames such as ‘Krabbendam’ and ‘Washington’).

  • Kyle Oetman | November 17, 2006 at 12:17 am |

    Sorry about the HTML snafu in my previous post (first-timer to the Comments board).
    One more uni-related item of interest before going to bed. I have not followed the Premiership for very long, but I happened to stumble across this blog entry from New York Addick today. In it, he makes a comment about “that silly season in the 1990s when Charlton decided to categorise their players alphabetically (eg. No.1, Stuart Balmer)”. Anyone know of other instances of assigning jersey numbers based on alphabetical order?

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 12:32 am |

    [quote comment=”23300″]Sorry about the HTML snafu in my previous post (first-timer to the Comments board).
    One more uni-related item of interest before going to bed. I have not followed the Premiership for very long, but I happened to stumble across this blog entry from New York Addick today. In it, he makes a comment about “that silly season in the 1990s when Charlton decided to categorise their players alphabetically (eg. No.1, Stuart Balmer)”. Anyone know of other instances of assigning jersey numbers based on alphabetical order?[/quote]

    Welcome, Kyle Oetman. This is really fascinating. I have no idea if any other team have done the alphabetical number thing, but I hope someone else comes up with something.

    Don’t worry about making mistakes—we all do.

  • Jason Axel | November 17, 2006 at 1:00 am |

    [quote comment=”23197″]Regarding Paul’s main page article:

    – Central Michigan’s new unis strike me as odd; in my experience, a two-level word mark like that is arched on top and straight on the bottom. These have both top and bottom arched. I like the circular feel this creates. Has it been done before?[/quote]

    what is the craziest thing is that we’ve switch basketball jerseys 3 years in a row now, switching from these black monstrosities and note we dont have black in our logo or anything….to these nike weird things last year… with only central on the front, and really rounded, circus like numbers….and this year, we dumped nike to go to adidas (which doesnt happen much) i really like the jerseys, except the whole really big shoulders, but i can deal with it. and its about time we got an away maroon jersey that looked good.

    whats really crazy….basketball is adidas, football is new balance, and we just announced this semester that nike is an official sponsor of apparel….so theres alot of competition around here…or something.

  • Jason Axel | November 17, 2006 at 1:04 am |

    Also, I’d like to introduce myself, since I am a first tome poster also, but a long time fan of UniWatch and the blog. I am a senior at Central Michigan University, so if you’ve got CMU uni questions or even some MAC questions, I can help ya out…..and i hate purple.

    classic as classic gets

  • NMK | November 17, 2006 at 2:10 am |

    There’s nothing strange about Ohio State’s full name starting with “the.” A lot of schools have names that do: The Pennsylvania State University. The University of Texas at Austin. The University of Michigan.

    Ohio State (or, depending on your point of view, everyone else) just makes a big deal out of not dropping the “the” when they abbreviate the way that most others do.

  • Minna H | November 17, 2006 at 2:30 am |

    Ok. Gotta do it. Gotta roll the numbers over. Welcome, Jason Axel. Thanks for the mini-history on Central Michigan. Gotta admit, I was wondering about the black unis—which I like except for the lettering—whin I didn’t see black in the logo.

  • blakeruns | November 17, 2006 at 3:35 am |

    [quote comment=”23287″][quote comment=”23286″]I really wish the Bruins would make their vintage jersey permanent:

    http://espn-i.starwa...

    That was a sexy looking game.[/quote]

    i wish every hockey game
    could be as aesthetically pleasing
    as that one

    i wish the kings would bring
    back the Gretzky-era black white and silvers.
    Hey, if Barry Melrose already
    brought back the mullet, it could happen

    and i wish the Anaheim Ducks ( =p bleccch )
    were still Mighty. And had the originial Disney
    movie uniforms. I cant stand the new ones.

  • Pete | November 21, 2006 at 2:32 pm |

    The oxford phenomenon seen on certain Saints players seems to actually be the byproduct of a slight modification of “Under-Armor” mock turtlenecks.

    Cutting the mock turtle below the chin will allow more room in the neck. However, it will also cause either side of the cut to fold down, resulting in a quasi-golf-shirt look.

    Of course, I have no confirmation on this, but the sleeves on most of the “collared” players seem to be consistent with “Under-Armor”.